Sapient interviewed by Laura Ingraham (Official thread - downloads - commentary)
Offline Updated thread on Sapient vs Laura Ingraham
The best damn atheist radio show that has ever been made, Rational Response Squad disected the Laura Ingraham interview. This was one of the best shows we did. Laura gave me enough material to unload and we were all livid at her. This show is full of raw emotion, but with tons of humor. If you have a problem with Laura being referred to as a "retarded cunt" then you should not listen to this broadcast.
(right click save as) Download the whole show for free now! <-- this is the file you are looking for
Two other noteworthy stories from the week I was interviewed with Laura Ingraham:
Here is a 4 minute segment on the Penn Jilette show in which he talks about the Blasphemy Challenge and the Rational Response Squad. He basically recorded a commercial for us.
Christian Science Monitor did a story on the Blasphemy Challenge within a bigger story. The portion she wrote about me was accurate.
Views about the Laura Ingraham interview from other threads on this site....
Laura Ingraham what a stupid bitch
My e-mail to Ms. Ingraham
Laura,
I will begin this letter by stating that I have never e-mailed any radio or T.V. program until now. After listening to your “interview” with Mr. Sapient, it was easy to see that you were out of your league. Your constant ad hominem attacks, in conjunction with the numerous strawman arguments you presented against atheism were appalling. Not to mention constantly cutting his mic and endlessly interrupting him, all the while he kept his cool. A person who holds a position of theism such as yours really has no choice but to resort to these tactics. A logical argument cannot be constructed that proves a supernatural being created the universe and then sacrificed itself to itself in order to save mankind from itself.
It was easy to discern that you were simply angry that many people do not believe in the fairytale that dictates your life. You are pathetic … I feel sorry for you, I truly do!
I just listened to the podcast discussing Brian Sapient's guest appearance on The Laura Ingraham Show.
Morality are commandments? Laura hasn't really read the bible. God's commandments are retarded! We get along with each other for survival and empathy.
About Mother Teresa, Apparently, Ingraham she never read Christopher Hitchens's scathing tome about her. If Teresa had been a secularist working with them, the people she cared for would have had clean facilities, food, clean clothes, and sterile needles. Millions of dollars that poured in to the charity went to the church and other missions. In Ingrams world, missionaries are there for "a reason." Mother Teresa's reason was to glorify the poor's suffering because they were suffering for Jesus! One major reason we have missionaries, especially in Africa, is because people have been missplaced because of religious intollerance and genocide.
I remember listening to Ingraham's show the day Terri Shiavo died. She went on and on about how the liberals killed this poor woman and how conservatives are about "the culture of life." Of course, that "culture of life" doesn't include the poor children that fell victim to mortar shells that her conservative president chose to drop on them. I liked it when she asked Brian what bible he reads. Pssst,, Laura, he read the same one you claim to know! "What about the women's sufferage movement?" She actually used that as an argument for theists activism! She needs to do some research on Elizabeth Statton and Susan B. Antony and what their beliefs were.
My views on the Ingraham vs Sapient faceoff
Greetings,
Before I listened to your debate with Laura Ingraham I had never really heard of the woman, so I googled her. I must admit that I found her career resume quite impressive but she is obviously lacking when it comes to the art of argumentation. Here are just four of the diverting and idiotic tactics she used:
1 - She tried to use the work of Christian missionaries as proof that there is a god and as justification for the continuation of Christianity. In my opinion, Christian charity isn't altruistic since they're only doing it because a book tells them that they have to do it in order to make it into Heaven. If a million Christians do charity work based on what a book tells them it's still not as noble as the charity work of ten atheists who do charity work without being nudged by religiosity.
2 - She asked you if you were ever going to get a job, which was a low blow and indicative of the way that Christians will desperately lash out (I thought they weren't supposed to judge people?!) when they find themselves inevitably backed into a corner.
3 - She asked you why you're up at night thinking about Christians, which was another low blow. Christianity got where it is today because Christians WERE up at night thinking about what non-Christians were doing. Christianity is where it is today because they were persistently gaining converts and voicing their views, or when that didn't work, they just killed people. At least atheists aren't killing people wholesale because they won't agree with our view
4 - The name-game was the most pathetic in my opinion. It had absolutely no relevance to the argument at hand. Naming intelligent people who believed in God, or APPEAR to have believed in God does not establish a correlation between intelligence and religion. Laura named Galileo but also left out the part where the church banned his "heretic" works, allowed him to speak to no one at religious festivals, put him on house arrest, and denied him burial at the Basilica of Santa Croce (he wasn't allowed to be buried there until almost a hundred years after his death)! She named Leonardo da Vinci but fails to realize that he was also a man of science and did not believe in the Biblical flood based on his scientific observations. If anything, they've contributed to the atheist movement because they were two great men who successfully challenged the Bible (although they didn't live to see the fruits of their success). PS: Is it really any wonder that many intelligent people during the Italian Renaissance professed to believe in God when you could be jailed or burned at the stake for not agreeing?!!
I initially sent this message via Youtube but I realized that nobody had visited the account in quite some time so I decided to send it here. Keep up the good work!
Sincerely,
God-Bane
A host of a business talk show decided to host me because he was disgusted with the way Laura Ingraham treated me on her show.
The story behind Brian Sapient with Saul Albom and downloads to the interview that connects atheism to the stock market... somehow.
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Offline Cannibalism? Where do you drag up this nonsense. I can find tales in history where Christians were accused of cannibalism too so I guess, using fundy logic, all Christians eat people too.
No wonder Atheists are always angry with you.
http://www.catherinedold.com/fcannibals.htm
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Offline The atheists who killed countless millions last century did so in complete harmony with their atheistic worldviews.
There is no atheistic worldview.
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Offline Brian wrote:Untill you accept what was done in the name of deities throughout human history you will not be a spokesperson for the suffering that Native Americans wrongly suffered through.
Oh what irony, how in the world do you look yourself in the mirror, There was more suffering done in the name of no god last century than in all other centuries combined.
And in your haste to condemn me, you seem to be conflating what the government did to the Indians and what the Christian missionaries did.
How is saying that you are blind to the dark side of all religion are capable of condemning you. If someone is in error in their logic how is it wrong to point that out to them.
Your vicious attacks are unfound and complete crap. No one here disires to barbaque your cats or take away your bible. BUT YOU ARE BLIND to the harm religion can cause by it's followers.
This is born out in human history from polytheims to modern monotheism. Untill humanity wakes up to that, they will continue to repeate the same mistakes.
YOU CAN GO SUCK AN EGG if you think I have any intrest in creating a dictatorship MORON. It is OUR CONSTITUTION that allows me to say what I do here. I am not about to cut that protection away from myself or you.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
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Offline Stalinists killed for stalinist ideology. Maoists killed on the behalf of their great leaps forward, and the like... they weren't killing in the name of no god. Whether or not any or all of them were atheists is incidental.
Stalin, Mao andPol Pot and others, all committed horrible atrocities in the name of a Communist ideology that was fully atheistic, tod.
Their deeds were done, trying to produce a “new man” and a religion-free utopia.
These were mass murders performed with atheism as a central part of their worldview, they were not mass murders done by people who just happened to be atheist.
Stop being silly, todangst.
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Offline Trout, how bout you stop wasting our time. (most importantly Todangsts time)
We're not broken records, like you appear to be, don't make us feel like we are.
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Offline Trout, how bout you stop wasting our time. (most importantly Todangsts time)
We're not broken records, like you appear to be, don't make us feel like we are.
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Offline Trout wrote:The atheists who killed countless millions last century did so in complete harmony with their atheistic worldviews.There is no atheistic worldview.
You don't think atheism was at the heart of communist thought? Come on Brian.
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Offline todangst wrote:Stalinists killed for stalinist ideology. Maoists killed on the behalf of their great leaps forward, and the like... they weren't killing in the name of no god. Whether or not any or all of them were atheists is incidental.
Stalin, Mao andPol Pot and others, all committed horrible atrocities in the name of a Communist ideology that was fully atheistic, tod.
Their deeds were done, trying to produce a “new man” and a religion-free utopia.
These were mass murders performed with atheism as a central part of their worldview, they were not mass murders done by people who just happened to be atheist.
Stop being silly, todangst.
Worshiping a state or human or diety blindly is STUPID, it doesnt matter if an atheist or theist is doing it. YOU are to damn stubborn to see that religion is capable of having blind followings.
NOW stop wasting our time with your fearmongering and bullshit equations to dictators. WE HATE DICTATORS TOO!
So knock of the bigoted crap, grow some balls and engauge us in debate. Otherwise you are wasting our time and yours.
Your next sentance should be:
"I claim deity X. Here is my evidence for deity X"
The inmature ad homins are wearing thin. GROW UP! I simply think you are afraid of compitition of ideas so insted of presenting a case for you deity you throw bullshit insults at us.
GROW SOME BALLS AND DEBATE! But do not think anyone here is going to put up with you or anyone else equating us to monsters.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
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Offline Sapient wrote:Trout wrote:The atheists who killed countless millions last century did so in complete harmony with their atheistic worldviews.There is no atheistic worldview.
You don't think atheism was at the heart of communist thought? Come on Brian.
Communism leads to atheism.
Atheism doesn't necessarily lead to communism.
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Offline NOW stop wasting our time with your fearmongering and bullshit equations to dictators. WE HATE DICTATORS TOO!
So you're willing to admit that atheism is respnsible for countless millions of deaths in the last few decades?
Are you willing to hate atheism taken to it's logical conclusion in the forms of Mao and Stalin?
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Offline Communism leads to atheism.
Let's finish that statement: Communism leads to atheism, and atheist communists are responsible for the death of countless millions over the course of the last several decades.
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Trout, you can always be counted on for an irrational claim, particularly if it's the sort a gradeschooler might make:
Stalinists and Maoists killed in the name of stalinism and maoism, in the names of their dogmatic ideology, not in the name of atheism. You've commited your latest weak causality fallacy.
Take a look at how little you know what your talking about. Atheism isn't a worldview, its a lack of belief in the claims of theists.
As for your comments about native americans.... I always figured you for a self hater...
Ladies and gentleman, a theist....
"Hitler burned people like Anne Frank, for that we call him evil.
"God" burns Anne Frank eternally. For that, theists call him 'good.'
Feel free to miss the point.
Atheists did horrific things last century. Don't try to claim the moral high-ground here Brian.
And thanks goes out to todangst who distances himself from Mao, allowing me to distance myself from all Christians who've done wrong in the name of Christ.
Trout, you are the one missing the point. I'll spell it out for you;
If some who believes in God kills someone or a group of people, they are not necessarily doing it for their God or because of their beliefs.
If an atheist kills someone or some people they are not necessarily doing it in the name of their atheism or because of that particular lack of belief.
Things like 9/11, The Crusades, the atrocities against the Native Americans (is many cases, not all), etc were done in the name of God or because of their theistic worldview.
Stalin and Mao were atheists, but it was another factor, that of a poltical regime, that made them kill.
The point is that it was their irrational ideas, ideologies, etc that caused them to kill. Whether it is Maoism, Stalinism, Catholicism, Wahhabism, anti-semitism, racism, or any other idea/worldview that is the cause of the hate, dislike, etc which leads to killing, it is never atheism!
Why not? Because atheism is not even an idea in itself, but a lack of a specific one. If not believing in unicorns is not even a possible reason to kill someone, how could not believing ina God be a reason? If someone, being an atheist, even says that "God doesn't exist so all is permitted so it doesn't matter if I kill people" there still has to be a SEPARATE REASON FOR KILLING THEM! That is, even if on'e slack of belief in a god doesn't stop them, there still needs to be another reason/cause to do it for it to happen.
Simply lacking a belief is not enough. Stalin was killing off political rivals and enemies. Mao was doing essentially the same thing. The Crusaders were also killing off enemies and rivals, but they ostensively did so with the Christian banner. So while one could show that their were political, nationalistic, and possible economic causes to these acts, it was religion that was used to rally the troops.
Never did stalin's henchman go around with atheist banners or chanting atheist chants while killing. They were killing for political reasons.
The simple truth is taht you cannot justify the killing of anyone due to te lack of belief in a God. Something in addition is required.
Atheism is not sufficient nor necessary justification for killing. Any killing done by an atheist, therefore, requires an additional cause to the act that is not atheism.
Religion, like that of the Bible's God, is sufficient for killing. It is not necessary, but it certainly is sufficient. Some religios are not sufficient, but Christianity certainly is.
Shaun
I'll fight for a person's right to speak so long as that person will, in return, fight to allow me to challenge their opinions and ridicule them as the content of their ideas merit.
I didn't miss the point. The point was atheists committed more acts of attrocity in the name of atheism then theists committed in the name of theism, and the point was a lie.
Yup, I agree with that. That wasn't your point.
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With comments like that I highly doubt your claims that you are a student of logic much less a Native American. I suppose you could be a Native American and just grossly into self-hating or absolutely ignorant about history to ignore the entire events of colonization from the 15th century on forward.
However your claims about Stalin and Mao are interesting. I don't know much about Mao but I see no evidence that Stalin was actually an Atheist. Sure he was a Communist but it was common practice to label all Communists as Atheists and all Atheists as Communists. In the Soviet Union the majority of Communists were Russian Orthodox and Stalin was a seminary student in that religion. I'm not aware of any historical instance where he renounced his religion like Trotsky (Judaism) did and became an Atheist.
It belies the point that you think someone can kill someone because there was no god to tell them to. You find this logical? Your arguments are as convincing as anything Gene Cook or Kent Hovind dreamed up, which is to say not at all.
Come to think of it I'm not aware that Mao was an Atheist any more than what is unusual for a Buddhist or a follower of Confucianism. However preceding his rise to power was a rebellion led by a guy who thought he was Jesus' brother and concluded with the deaths of 20 million people and the fall of the Manchu dynasty. So if it wasn't for Christianity telling a man of faith to kill millions of people Mao wouldn't have risen to power.
Do you seriously need a history lesson on Native Americans and missionaries? Cannibalism? Where do you drag up this nonsense. I can find tales in history where Christians were accused of cannibalism too so I guess, using fundy logic, all Christians eat people too.
No wonder Atheists are always angry with you.
You should thank your own reading comprehension problem instead.
I just informed you that it's a weak analogy/weak causality error to attribute the deaths caused by Stalinist/Maoist idealogy to atheism, just as it would be an error to attribute their murders to the fact that they wore pants.... both matters: wearing pants, being atheists, are incidental to the actual motives for their acts.
On the other hand, those who have done 'wrong' in the 'name of christ' are in fact doing wrong in the name of christ, ergo the belief is a root cause of their actions.
"The name Christians was first given at Antioch (Acts 11:26) to ‘the disciples’, to those who accepted the teaching of the apostles. There is no question it being restricted to those who profited by that teaching as much as they should have.- C. S. Lewis, Mere Christianity.
"Hitler burned people like Anne Frank, for that we call him evil.
"God" burns Anne Frank eternally. For that, theists call him 'good.'
And if the person doing the killing claims to be Christian, it can be easily demonstrated that the killing was done in contradistinction to the commands of Christ.
Why not? If an evil dictator determines that he has no superior, no one to answer to, no God to call master, why would it be wrong to kill others?
The strong rule the weak, survival of the fittest.
Shaun, let's say you were walking down a dark alley in a dangerous part of Philly, suddenly a group of ten large men approach you in the alley, would you feel comforted to know that these men just left a Bible study?
As usual, you're the one commiting the error you accuse others of commiting... you're missing the point.
1) That would not change the fact that they are killing in the name of their religion as they see it. Of course religious groups disagree on these matters... that's precisely why they fight.
2) I doubt its really as easy as you see it... considering your own 'good book' includes commands from your god to slaughter various people, and so on.... each group thinks that their vision is the clear one...
"Hitler burned people like Anne Frank, for that we call him evil.
"God" burns Anne Frank eternally. For that, theists call him 'good.'
And yet completely in line with God.
See God murders over 2 million people in the bible.
Delusional people don't bring me comfort, they are like ticking time bombs that would be much more scary then comforting.
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He clearly knows nothing of logic. He's an ever flowing fountain of fallacies.
I love the 'john wayne' picture...
Apparently he's far more angry with himself than anyone else is with him....
"Hitler burned people like Anne Frank, for that we call him evil.
"God" burns Anne Frank eternally. For that, theists call him 'good.'
As usual, you'd be wrong.
The atheists who killed countless millions last century did so in complete harmony with their atheistic worldviews.
Great argument. Hey, what else can you do but stamp your feet, close your eyes, and say, "no, you're wrong!"
Again, you're commiting a weak analogy error. I don't expect you to concede that. But at least work it out for yourself so you can stop embarrassing yourself with this bad argument.
Stalinists killed for stalinist ideology. Maoists killed on the behalf of their great leaps forward, and the like... they weren't killing in the name of no god. Whether or not any or all of them were atheists is incidental.
Ah, you're already running from your position.... now it's merely 'in harmony' with their worldview, and no longer the cause.
However, errors still abound here, mainly due to your ignorance of the matter, and your insistence on remaining ignorant despite the arguments before you.
There is no such thing as an atheist worldview, as has already been explained to you. There is no 'one view' that a lack of belief in god leads a person towards....
As for a moral system, about the closest one might come to finding an 'atheist morality' would be secular humanism... but again, not every 'atheist' holds to it, and it's not a part of 'atheism".
I defy you to find anywhere within the precept of holding humans to be a value onto themselves, a view that is consistent with killing people.
"Hitler burned people like Anne Frank, for that we call him evil.
"God" burns Anne Frank eternally. For that, theists call him 'good.'
The slaughter of millions done by atheists seems to be in complete harmony with an atheistic worldview.
Yup, I agree with that. That wasn't your point.
I'm glad we can agree on something.