If I believed I'd be in a wheelchair or Dead
Offline Hmm... well I am not sure if this goes here or free thinking but I would love to get some Theist opinions, aswell as my fellow Rationalists...
So back in the day I was like 10 or 12, I had a severely dehabilitating Brain anorism leaving me with a left side deficit. But now this really doesnt bother me as I lead a pretty normal life. I have been told it was a miraculous recovery, however this was due to self motivation and giving all the crediy to myself.
as I was dealing with all these annoying people including my parents saying God is looking out for/gaurdian Angel etc.. Now truthfully I am the kid that told Nuns to Fuck off as they were coming to bless my recovery and I chucked a Bible out the door of my rehab hospital window(it wasn't mine but it was on the nightstand near my bed). but now I am more lax about that shit untill you hand me a Jesus Pamphlet(I lost a girlfriend for that one, oops.LOL).
Back to my point which is I believe if I agknoleged God back in sunday-school when I was 5 I think I would still be a lump in a wheelchair. yes Even When I was five I was offended by church, I dont know why... I just know the very concept of color a dead guy didnt feel right.
So would this have come with a worse out come in your-life if you gave all your strength to a belief and not your inner self? if you feel you would not have had any differance, then explain what would drive you to walk when doctors think it impossibl(sorry I forgot to add doctors discouraging analysis.) ????????
If God didn't want atheists than we wouldn't exist..
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dude, this is a perfect poster child story (even though you're not a child anymore), and should be used worldwide as 'evidence' against the 'power of prayer', (which we all know is the same as lucky horseshoes).
"i accosted those who came to pray for me, and personally rejected the holy spirit, and still i recovered, in a fashion that some would term "miraculous". i find it to be a load of bullshit, frankly......"
Fear is the mindkiller.
I don't see how this follows since I'm sure Christians survive tramatic events and make recoveries as well.
I have a true story similiar to your's. My aunt is 78 and has had breast cancer that she has recovered from since. However, last year I had to go back home to attend a funeral for one of my brothers. Before I had gotten back my aunt fallen ill and had been in the hospital for 3 weeks or so. While I was home I went to visit her in the hospital several times. I thought before I had left we would be burying her as well. The tests they had given her were inconclusive as to whether her cancer had returned or not and gone to her spleen. The doctors had almost all but told her that she was dying of cancer even though there was no conclusive proof. This is a very small town hospital with no real cancer specialists. Eventually, they had to transfer her to a larger hospital because she was going down hill fast. When she had gotten to the other hospital, they ran the proper tests and discovered the spots in the xray were just shadows and she had no signs of her cancering returning. She had been suffering from pnuemonia and that was it. The doctors had put the fear that she was dying into her head. Once she realized she was not dying she got better on her own. Their entire church and our family had been praying for her, and appears that it didn't do any good.
"Always seek out the truth, but avoid at all costs those that claim to have found it" ANONYMOUS
It is obvious that the person is evil and the devil cured his illness so he could use him in future for his evil atheist propaganda.
I would imagine a Christian would say something like that or possibly a little tamer when face with this evidence.
If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.
Well I am "in a wheelchair" although it's more appropriate to say i *use* a wheelchair because believe it or not people that use wheelchairs actually can get out of them and drive a car, sit on the couch and watch tv for a few hours or ... well i'll stop there before i get into the kinky sex stuff.
anyway, i would agree that lack of belief in god is more motivating than any flavor of theism. i have several life threatening conditions and i have been told by many doctors that they have never seen nor even heard of anyone with one of my conditions (much less all of them) that still routinely gets out of bed. sure, there's a whole bunch of drugs involved in that but also a whole bunch of realization that this is the only life or chance i'm going to get.
very cool I am glad you agree, by the way I would prefer you share more of that kinky sex stuff, LOL. oh btw you rock.
If God didn't want atheists than we wouldn't exist..
lol I dont know about a Poster child but making Nuns cry was fun.
Fair enough but after such an event do they realize its them or do they hank God??? do they continue to percevere tho Say doing hikes most people that never had an injury would be to lazy to do????
I have never heard a Christian success story that doesn,t end in "I thank god for his strength".
If God didn't want atheists than we wouldn't exist..
If you just sit around and wait for your 'miracle' cure, I'm sure god and no god result in the same rate of cures arriving. random chance? genetics? whatever...
I think the point the OP was making is that when you're told you can't do something sometimes you actually can if you push yourself. Just because it's unlikely or other people aren't doing it isn't a reason for why you can't.
I physically *can't* walk. I have a spinal cord injury, severe severe severe osteoporosis and even if I didn't, the majority of the femur has been removed from both my legs as well as portions of my pelvic bone due to infection. So yeah, just like God doesn't heal amputees, no miracle cure is going to have me getting up and running around the block.
However, I make my own decisions when it comes to going to school or the grocery store or whatever... my determination... sitting around and waiting for my invisible friend to 'fix' me isn't going to get dinner on the table. Sure, some Christians use god as their motivation. Great. (sarcasm) This isn't about weather some people can get by using some god concept as a coping mechanism.
Pineapple, I think the OP and I are simply arguing that knowing this is your one chance and that you can be your own strength is a whole hell of a lot more motivating in the long term than prayer. No pain, no gain as they say...
hey you are right on there Shelley, I mean you and I seem to share more than just the atheism as a purpose of survival, atleast thats the understanding I have of you. I feel we have similar takes on the matter of religion vs. human will I would really enjoy chatting on Skype if you have it. if youd like to I can just pm you my sn.
If God didn't want atheists than we wouldn't exist..
ahh... so you really do want to hear more about the kinky sex stuff.
HaHa, Well wast my intent but if you wanna make the offer... I wont mind, lol
, lol.
It's worth noting that every time a theist claims something is a "miracle", there's always a likely, rational explanation available too.
Wake me up when someone's amputated limb regenerates overnight. Then I'll be impressed.