I Need Some Help

Knight
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I Need Some Help

Hi everyone.

Okay, so my mom and I have been been having some intense philosophical discussions. Good ones, not bad at all. This is because, after two long years, I've finally come out of my closet with my atheism.

There are some things that she wants me to explain, and I figured that the Rational Response Squad should be able to help me out. Smiling Please? I'm looking for anything that can explain each happening naturally that a layman should be able to understand.

1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.

2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

I think that's it. Well, I don't thin I gave very satisfying answers. I think I'd like some more input.

Thanks,

Knight


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Knight wrote:1. A few years

Knight wrote:

1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.

I'm not sure anyone could explain to you what happened without before and after pictures.

Knight wrote:
2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

I suspect you've been pranked. There are ways to produce this effect fairly easily.

Knight wrote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Poor power quality (occasional surges will cause that effect).

Knight wrote:
5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

Did it happen to pull in the direction of the flat tire? Because that's normal.

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Knight wrote:1. A few years

Knight wrote:


1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.
 

Somebody moved all the stuff off the shelf.

Knight wrote:


2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

Delusion, interference, something like that.

Knight wrote:


3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

Ghost.  btw, why did it want them out of the house?  Did it catch on fire or something or was the voice just being antisocial?

Knight wrote:


4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

The spring inside of the toy carrousel was getting weak and could only barely and occasional move the internal mechanisms

Knight wrote:


5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

The front tire blew out which caused the steering wheel to jerk in the direction of the side that the tire blew.  That's pretty obvious.

If none of these answers are satisfactory then Jake did it.

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Tell her they're atheist

Tell her they're atheist ghosts.  *rim shot*

 

Ok seriously, this is just speculation...

1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.

Possibly another family member cleared it, or your mom cleared it and her recollection is vague. 

 



2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

 

These two could be anything.  It could be your subconscious, or a memory of a voice that had been heard somewhere, and your brain applies it at that moment.  Like a guilty conscience talking to you yet you can't place the fact that your brain is creating the audible sound which is really just in your head.



4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Uri Geller the "illusionist" has a routine in which he asks people to find a broken watch and then hold it, or tap it, and will it to work.  He does this because even when a battery dies there can be a small charge left in the battery that could make a dead battery tick again for a few moments.  This type of thing could've happened on the carousel.  Also it's possible that gears that hold the carousel in the off position were slightly worn causing it to skip a beat from time to time, creating the illusion that something turned it on, when it could've simply been someone walking on the floor and jarring the device just enough to give it a few revolutions.


5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

Again she's likely applying wishful thinking.  It was most likely her subconscious reacting in a self defense mode and her handle on those specific thoughts are gone after the stress subsides.  Especially at life harrowing moments it's easy to lose sight of our conscious thoughts and the thoughts that kick in without you thinking about it.  In a stressed situation like that, all bets are off.  While this one may seem the most important to her it's the situations where no stress is involved that I think are worth solving. 

 

When that's all said and done, lighten the mood a bit... it's the ghost of atheism.  I suggest even pulling pranks for a little while pretending to be the ghost, and tell her it was you each time afterwards.  Maybe down the road instead of her subconscious reacting on a lifetime of paranormal bullshit brainwashing (which she likely has, like almost everyone on Earth) maybe her subconscious will simply say "it's Knight playing another prank.:

 

 

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HisWillness wrote:Knight

HisWillness wrote:


Knight wrote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Poor power quality (occasional surges will cause that effect).

A powered toy carrousel?  Have you ever seen one?  They are wind up.  sheesh

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Knight wrote:1. A few years

Knight wrote:



1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.

Not sure I understand. There was a shelf of stuff then there wasn't?

Knight wrote:
2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

I've experienced this.We lived next to a radio ham and I got his stuff through my speakers once.Scared me to death.

Knight wrote:
3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

To be honest, don't know.Sometimes I'm sure I hear the tv when it's off.Can't give you a good explanation though.

Knight wrote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Again, don't know.Cheap carrousel?

Knight wrote:
5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

Considering the tire just blew,I'm not surprised it went off the road. And considering the highly pumped state you'd be in, I'm not sure anything she 'felt' gets much credence.

Knight wrote:
I think that's it. Well, I don't thin I gave very satisfying answers. I think I'd like some more input.

 

These are tought to answer, because they are very real to the people they happened to and they find it proof of something.The mind doesn't like vacumns and always tries to fill it, which is why we see patterns in things and could possibly hear words in noises I guess.Hopefully some others can help you.

Psalm 14:1 "the fool hath said in his heart there is a God"-From a 1763 misprinted edition of the bible

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Watcher wrote:HisWillness

Watcher wrote:

HisWillness wrote:


Knight wrote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Poor power quality (occasional surges will cause that effect).

A powered toy carrousel?  Have you ever seen one?  They are wind up.  sheesh

I'm sorry, I was referring to nuclear powered carrousels.

Oh, CARROUSELS. I thought we were talking about submarines.

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HisWillness wrote:A powered

HisWillness wrote:

A powered toy carrousel?  Have you ever seen one?  They are wind up.  sheesh

To be honest, I didn't know what the fuck he was talking about. A toy carrousel as in a wind-up thing that has horses going in a circle? I've never seen one of those, no.

Anyway, if it's wind up, that's the spring.

Pff ... toy carrousel. You guys are into some weird shit.

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Knight wrote:Hi everyone. Hi

Knight wrote:

Hi everyone.

Hi Knight!

Quote:
Okay, so my mom and I have been been having some intense philosophical discussions. Good ones, not bad at all. This is because, after two long years, I've finally come out of my closet with my atheism.

There are some things that she wants me to explain, and I figured that the Rational Response Squad should be able to help me out. Smiling Please? I'm looking for anything that can explain each happening naturally that a layman should be able to understand.

I'd be glad to help.

Quote:
1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.

Are you suggesting this was some sort of spiritual event?  Believe it or not, most incidents like this tend to be caused by a family member who just either (1) forgot they'd cleared it or (2) was never asked if they did.  This sounds like either your dad, or siblings, cleared off the shelf (perhaps even over time and you just realized it at that moment when you decided you needed a place for the printer).

Quote:
2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

Children hear all sorts of things, and you're no different.  It could have been your mom or dad saying that from another room.  You should not let tricks of the mind tease you into believing that these seemingly-paranoid thoughts represent an actual being. 

Quote:
3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

Stress.  Often times people "experience" so-called supernatural events when they are at their most tense or when they are stressed out about something.  Often times it reflects personal emotions.  Perhaps they needed a night out?  Also be wary about incidents like this.  Often times, societal pressure or peer pressure is involved.  It's called memory contamination.  It goes something like this...

"Hunny did you hear that?"

"What?"

"It sounded like something."

"A male voice?"

"Maybe...yeah."

 

Etc...

When your brain does not fully analyze an event, or can't for whatever reason, it fills in blanks.  It is like the "Phoenix lights" where people thought they were seeing an alien spacecraft, but really they were seeing flares from Air Force craft flying over the area.  The flares fell in a pattern, and because it was dark, people filled in the blank space behind the flares with blackness, making it appear as if the flares were lights circling a very large spacecraft. 

A similar event that you may interpret easier is when in the middle of the night, you may reach over and try to grab something off a night stand or walk to the bathroom.  Your senses will play tricks on you, and you may miss the nightstand by a few inches or more because your eyes did not interpret the distance correctly...or you may walk into a wall for the same reasons. 

Quote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Um, does it have a "wind-up" aperture?  Often times those things get stuck, and sometimes they unwind, and go for a few seconds, sometimes longer.  Ever wind up a toy, put it on the ground, and have it walk a few feet then stop...and you'd have to pick it up (holding the feet) and move it, set it back down and it would go again?  Same sort of thing. 

Quote:
5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

I think she's been listening to "Jesus Take the Wheel" a little too much for her own good.  The steering column is connected to the tires.  If the tires are following the road, often times it will follow the grooves of the road made from previous cars which drive over these roads all the time.  These are really weak arguments, and many have logical or natural explanations.  It seems like your mom just wants to believe the supernatural explanations because she has been raised to believe them all her life.

Quote:
I think that's it. Well, I don't thin I gave very satisfying answers. I think I'd like some more input.

Thanks,

Knight

I suggest you take the time to read my article on ghost stories and hauntings and how they evolve over time. 

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Knight
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Rook_Hawkins wrote:Knight

Rook_Hawkins wrote:

Knight wrote:

Hi everyone.

Hi Knight!

Quote:
Okay, so my mom and I have been been having some intense philosophical discussions. Good ones, not bad at all. This is because, after two long years, I've finally come out of my closet with my atheism.

There are some things that she wants me to explain, and I figured that the Rational Response Squad should be able to help me out. Smiling Please? I'm looking for anything that can explain each happening naturally that a layman should be able to understand.

I'd be glad to help.

Thanks!

Quote:


Quote:
1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.

Are you suggesting this was some sort of spiritual event?  Believe it or not, most incidents like this tend to be caused by a family member who just either (1) forgot they'd cleared it or (2) was never asked if they did.  This sounds like either your dad, or siblings, cleared off the shelf (perhaps even over time and you just realized it at that moment when you decided you needed a place for the printer).

No. I'm sorry, I wasn't clear at all. I was actually present, along with my parents. We were discussing where we were going to put the printer, and the stuff on the shelf "flew" () off and onto the floor.

 

Quote:


Quote:
2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

Children hear all sorts of things, and you're no different.  It could have been your mom or dad saying that from another room.  You should not let tricks of the mind tease you into believing that these seemingly-paranoid thoughts represent an actual being. 

My mom and dad were in Las Vegas, actually. And my brother and grandma heard it, as well. That's why I suspected the CBs. But yes, I do agree with you.

Quote:


Quote:
3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

Stress.  Often times people "experience" so-called supernatural events when they are at their most tense or when they are stressed out about something.  Often times it reflects personal emotions.  Perhaps they needed a night out?  Also be wary about incidents like this.  Often times, societal pressure or peer pressure is involved.  It's called memory contamination.  It goes something like this...

"Hunny did you hear that?"

"What?"

"It sounded like something."

"A male voice?"

"Maybe...yeah."

 

Etc...

When your brain does not fully analyze an event, or can't for whatever reason, it fills in blanks.  It is like the "Phoenix lights" where people thought they were seeing an alien spacecraft, but really they were seeing flares from Air Force craft flying over the area.  The flares fell in a pattern, and because it was dark, people filled in the blank space behind the flares with blackness, making it appear as if the flares were lights circling a very large spacecraft. 

A similar event that you may interpret easier is when in the middle of the night, you may reach over and try to grab something off a night stand or walk to the bathroom.  Your senses will play tricks on you, and you may miss the nightstand by a few inches or more because your eyes did not interpret the distance correctly...or you may walk into a wall for the same reasons. 

 

Very interesting...but she'll never believe this, so I think I'll leave it at that. This actually makes sense though.

Quote:


Quote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.

Um, does it have a "wind-up" aperture?  Often times those things get stuck, and sometimes they unwind, and go for a few seconds, sometimes longer.  Ever wind up a toy, put it on the ground, and have it walk a few feet then stop...and you'd have to pick it up (holding the feet) and move it, set it back down and it would go again?  Same sort of thing. 

Yes, it was a wind-up. This makes sense to me, but I don't know if she'll buy it.

Quote:


Quote:
5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

I think she's been listening to "Jesus Take the Wheel" a little too much for her own good.  The steering column is connected to the tires.  If the tires are following the road, often times it will follow the grooves of the road made from previous cars which drive over these roads all the time.  These are really weak arguments, and many have logical or natural explanations.  It seems like your mom just wants to believe the supernatural explanations because she has been raised to believe them all her life.

I actually told her this that the car going to the side of the road or in the direction of the blown out tire would be normal, but she doesn't believe me.

Quote:


Quote:
I think that's it. Well, I don't thin I gave very satisfying answers. I think I'd like some more input.

Thanks,

Knight

I suggest you take the time to read my article on ghost stories and hauntings and how they evolve over time. 

 

Thanks!


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Quote:I don't know if she'll

Quote:

I don't know if she'll buy it.

Well, then what will she buy? These arguments are all extraordinarily weak, the sorts of phenomenon that are easily explained with some simple investigation. There is no reason to invent an entirely seperate ontological reality that can unknowingly interact with the material world on the basis of words heard whispered on CDs and the motion of cars due the flat tyres. There is no logical connection between the assertion (a) that there exists a realm wholly seperate for and responsible for maintaining the physical universe on the basis of some conscious entity which exercises control over the world we experience and (b) the 5 arguments just put forth. The precise refutations of each point have already been given, but it sounds like what is really needed is just some basic understanding of logic and epistemology. There first thing to note is that she is making an ad ignorantium fallacy, effectively assuming her explanation to be a sort of "default" until a proper explanation can be brought in. Yet, as we have seen, there is no meaningful justificatory grounds to assume this "default" especially when it is so extravagant as to reinvent the ontological basis for reality. Second, she is demanding we give a precise explanation for a phenomenon whilst simultaneously exempting herself from doing the same. Just for kicks, ask her to outline the proposed mechanism in a very clear way as to the manner in which some supernatural event was responsible for these phenomenon. If she responds with just those words, start asking technical questions such as "how does this supernatural entity have causal powers given that you've exempted physical causality from its properties?", etc. These questions will demonstrate her "default" explanation collapses for reasons of both logic and ontology.

My immediate impression is that your mother needs to be better versed in lateral thinking. Lateral thinking is, as the name suggests, broad in scope. It comes in most useful when everyday problems have apparantly no solution. The solution might be so obvious that it is hidden in plain sight, but because we tend to miss these, we invent overly complex explanations for phenomenon. Revising the ontological basis of reality on the basis of such experiences is one example. An exercise in this type of thinking should teach us that the "first thing that comes to mind" when we try to envisage a solution to an otherwise unexplained phenomenon is very rarely trustworty. These sorts of situations are commonplace. A few weeks ago, when I logged into my laptop, it simply entered the account without a password, as normally needed. The first thought that came to my mind was "someone's hacked it". But, knowing about lateral thinking and parsimony, I realized that was ridiculous, so I checked the control panel settings and realized the computer had opened the account on its own because I had recently set it to standby after a few minutes so it wouldn't lose battery power. This sort of thing happens all the time. We lose clothes and immediately think of theives and pranksters, but it turns out to be our own carelessness. Don't trust the default explanation, it is riddled with psychological bias.

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There's been good

There's been good explanations put forward allready. I was gonna mention memory contamination too, but I see Rook beat me to it, so: what he said...

 

But there is a more important point here. You say you are having philosophical discussions with her. These things you mention aren't very philosophical, discussing these kinds of things is actually a very practical, real life cause/effect type things.

 

The philosophical implications of these things require a different answer than to try and explain them. Sure you can explain what might have caused them in purely material terms, (and good suggestions have allready been put forward on how to do that), but you also need to adress the point that maybe an answer doesn't have to be forthcoming to everything in this world. The universe doesn't ow us insight into it's mechanisms. If we are skillful enough and lucky enough to see through it, then that's fine, but putting an explanation (I don't know what your mother explains it with: God? Spirits?) to something like this is not doing justice to it's mystery, and I imagine that's exactly what she thinks it does.

 

When someone says: "X is mysterious and inexplicaple, therefore X means that God/spirits are real" then they have just explained X, and then it is not mysterious, and it explained, not inexplicaple.

 

I have seen many UFO's in my life, but the difference between me and Alien-crazies is that when I see an Unidentafiable Flying Object I don't identify it. If I did it would be an IFO. Granted, all the things I have seen in the night sky that I could not immediately identify, I have been able to say with reasonable certainty was probably a satelite or an airplane, but the point remains that when I didn't get a postive ID on the object, it really was a UFO. But I still don't believe in space aliens.

 

Ask your mother this, about the rearranged shelf for example, or one of the voices.

 

Could it have been God? (Or substitute for the thing she mostly believes it is)

Then ask:

Could it have been a ghost?

Could it have been space Aliens?

Could it have been lebrecauns?

At some point you will ask something that she personally has no belief in whatsoever, and when she says a flatout "no" then you can say:

"It is okay to admit that you can't explain somethings. Atheists don't necesseraly feel they can explain everything, but while it is okay to say 'I don't know', it is also okay to be skeptical, and dismiss some things that are clearly silly, like lebrecauns or shelf-rearranging gremlins, if there is absolutely no evidence forthcoming for such a propasition. What is NOT okay, however, is to conclude on little or no evidence that there IS an explanation that can be gleaned from it (Like God, or ghosts). If you don't have enough evidence for a given propasition, the only intellectually honest thing is to say 'I don't know' and leave it at that."

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I doubt that if more than 1

I doubt that if more than 1 person heard the same thing it was imaginary, but there are other explanations:

 

Coincidence: "Put your toy down" was part of the song or there was deliberate or accidental interference, "Get out of the house" was said be a neighbor fighting with a spouse, or someone said it at the window as a joke, etc.

 

There's also (I forget the term) the phenonmena where any noise can sound like a voice (this is why there are words heard when records are played backwards - assuming it wasn't purposely added - also the reason for "EVP"'s Especially if one heard it and said to the other what they thought they heard.

 

A couple of my friends once played a joke on an old woman who claimed to be a with by getting a universal remote and changing the channels on her TV from the window. They said she bowed down and worshipped the "spirit."

 

 

 

*** Edit to add that I just want to point out that giving a supernatural explanation just because you don't know exactly why something happened is very poor reasoning.

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Knight wrote:Hi

Knight wrote:

Hi everyone.

It's like an AA meeting.  "Hiiiiii, Kniiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight."

Quote:


There are some things that she wants me to explain, and I figured that the Rational Response Squad should be able to help me out. Smiling Please? I'm looking for anything that can explain each happening naturally that a layman should be able to understand.

Well, only you know your mom, so only you know how likely she is to take a non-paranormal explanation for the below.  Sure, you can talk about the lensing effects of atmosphere on light, but if she's decided it was a UFO, she's not going to believe otherwise just because you can explain or demonstrate the phenomenon.

On to the situations!

Quote:


2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

Yup.  I had a friend that lived in an old apartment building.  After a fair bit of rain, she could hear an AM radio station while on the phone together, but I couldn't (meaning the signal was being induced in the phone itself, not in the wires).  Same kind of thing as when using a cordless phone and you pick up half of someone else's conversation.

Quote:


3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

What else was in the room?  Sure, the TV was off, but what about the radio?  Also, did the voice say "get out of the house" or did it say "et ow oh eh oooows"?  People misinterpret what they hear all the time; ask any couple. Eye-wink

Quote:

5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."

That's physics and mechanics.  A blown tire creates drag on that side of the car, which will make the car "steer" that way.  Yes, the steering wheel changes the angle of the tires, but since there's a rod involved, the angle of the tires also moves the steering wheel.

This one can actually be duplicated, though!  To test this, at a low speed on a deserted road with a soft shoulder (assume all relevant safety warnings issued at this point), let your tires drift off the road and onto the shoulder; you'll "feel" the wheel jerk under your hands towards the shoulder.  To a lesser extent, you can also feel this by driving one side through a deep puddle or a snow drift.

 

 

 

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Knight wrote:No. I'm sorry,

Knight wrote:
No. I'm sorry, I wasn't clear at all. I was actually present, along with my parents. We were discussing where we were going to put the printer, and the stuff on the shelf "flew" (

) off and onto the floor.

 

Need more info.  Were there things on other shelves above and below the shelf that was cleared, and if so, did they move at all?  Was anyone watching the shelf at the time?  Could you tell the direction of initial motion for the objects?  Was it horizontal or was there an initial vertical component?  Did the objects tumble or did they slide?  Did you notice anything else unusual at the time, such as a minor earthquake or a car driving by with a loud stereo?  Was anyone in the room thinking or talking about that specific shelf at the time?  Have you used a level to determine if the shelf was truly flat?  What kinds of objects were on the shelf?


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Quote:Need more info.  Were

Quote:
Need more info.  Were there things on other shelves above and below the shelf that was cleared, and if so, did they move at all?  Was anyone watching the shelf at the time?  Could you tell the direction of initial motion for the objects?  Was it horizontal or was there an initial vertical component?  Did the objects tumble or did they slide?  Did you notice anything else unusual at the time, such as a minor earthquake or a car driving by with a loud stereo?  Was anyone in the room thinking or talking about that specific shelf at the time?  Have you used a level to determine if the shelf was truly flat?  What kinds of objects were on the shelf?

To be very honest, I don't remember it that well at all. Yes, there were things below and above it, and they did not move at all. No one was watching the shelf. The initial motion of the objects seem out and down. I don't know if it was horizontal or if there was an initial vertical component. I suppose they slid (nothing rolled). Everything was fairly quiet, if I remember correctly. No one was talking about that shelf specifically. I don't know if the shelf was truly flat. On the shelf were notebooks (as in the ones with the lined paper in them, the standard size), and an ashtray.

I would like to thank everyone for their responses so far. I think I have something to work with if the topic comes up again.


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Hmm... if no one was

Hmm... if no one was watching the shelf at the time, then I would expect that to mean that the observations are less reliable... if the shelf wasn't being directly observed, then the brain has less input on the event, and that would leave more room for it to "fill in the blanks" with imagination and false memory.  Since it happened a long time ago, that makes the remembered details even more suspect.  Still, if you remember witnessing it and your parents also remember witnessing it, that pretty well rules out a dream as a possible explanation.  If you're correct that the objects on the other shelves didn't in fact move at all, that would seem to rule out any shaking of the bookshelf.  Still, things don't just happen without a cause.  Assuming everything happened the way you describe it, and assuming the objects weren't somehow rigged as a joke, I don't see any physical explanation, but even if the cause is spiritual in nature, there's no reason to attribute it to a god.  Why would a god care about where someone puts their printer?  If the cause is spiritual in nature, I would think it more likely that it was either you, one of your parents, or perhaps something akin to a ghost.  Nikolaj nailed this one pretty well, I think:

Nikolaj wrote:
If you don't have enough evidence for a given propasition, the only intellectually honest thing is to say 'I don't know' and leave it at that."

The only thing I would add is that if you're really curious, you can still investigate... just be careful not to jump to any conclusions.


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Hi Knight.A lot of good

Hi Knight.

A lot of good responses here. I'd like to add, that if the shelf was the type to sit on metal brackets, or pegs (the moveable type of shelf)...there is a good chance that the weight of the objects on the shelf were off balance causing the items to be flipped off. I have had this happen to me in the office. One time I noticed one of the little pegs the shelf was sitting on was missing which caused the imbalance.


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From a psychological point

From a psychological point of view this could simply be a case of suggestion.  No way to tell where it started but the mind is able to conjure up some pretty bizarre stuff.  The power of suggestion can cause all sorts of illusions, including hallucinations in extreme cases.  There have been some excellent explanations here and they are probably quite accurate in as much as the shelf might have been cleared by someone else in the house who thought the response was a good practical joke, or your mom's memory of cleaning the shelf is vague; at the time she was cleaning she could have been thinking about something impacting your lives, or simply something important to her in a personal vein.  The emotions or thoughts involved in this could have easily blurred her memory.

Often we can be thinking of something (an incident, a movie recently watched or just about anything) which triggers a past memory or subconscious thought and we think we hear something, a noise or voice and sometimes this even manifests itself as a recognizable phrase. In any event these are in no way of divine origin.  If all of us here are wrong (highly doubtful) and there is a god, then he's a practical joker and not someone I would trust with my immortal soul.

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Don't be afraid dear mods,

Don't be afraid dear mods, this post is quite rational.

 

Knight wrote:

1. A few years ago, an entire shelf had cleared out on my mom's computer desk. We had been talking about where to put a printer when this happened. I do remember very clearly that this did indeed happen.


What if someone cleared the desk at night, in a state of somnambulia. Somnambulia is a medically known and non-controversial state, in which people can do even very complicated things. They can also walk and speak coherently, which is what happened to me. So far only once, years ago, so I wouldn't be surprised if it would happen to you or other person at home, without any previous case.


Knight wrote:
2. I was playing a video game as a child, and my brother was playing a CD, and a voice came through the stereo system and said, "Put your toy down." I know about CBs, but can they cause interference when a CD is playing?

 3. My mom and step dad heard a voice coming from my old room, and the tv was off. It said, "Get out of the house." What could cause that?

As for 2) did your brother hear this voice too?
We had here a similar case with my grandfather. My mom heard suddenly a melody sounding like played by a small electronic mechanism, which are built-in to some cheap stuff. She heard this sound twice, once at grandma's house and then later that day at ours. Neither grandma nor we have such devices at home, but it would fit to my dead grandfather, who collected a lot of souvenirs when he was alive. This was confirmed by a clairvoyant person later. Grandfather reputedly wanted to greet us, to show that he's thinking about us well. So, thanks gramp  He was quite a weird and ridiculous, but very self-conscious person, we always had a great fun of him behind his back. In fact, all neighbours had, nobody really couldn't help it, so it's good to know he doesn't have any hard feelings. Though I'd rather know nothing at all.
So, the point is that I consider the possibility of a ghost creating  a sound in someone's mind, not the sound waves audible as such. That would rather require a poltergeist, smashing stuff.
If you have a radio station near house, then it's possible too, I heard about it at my electronics lessons, but I would expect it to happen more regularly, then. Like a constant echo of radio in your speakers, caught by wires stretched around. Sometimes the radio signal in wires may be stronger than the input signal itself. The case I heard about was in a church, which had the speakers installed for a pastor on a rostrum, far from speakers (long wires), and just next to the church was a satanistic radio station with a stronger signal Smiling

Knight wrote:
4. My mom's carrousel's used to play for a few minutes at a time on their own. She wants that explained.
  Probably a technical glitch, like HisWillness and others says. If it happened several times, or even regularly, I'd be sure about it.

Knight wrote:
5. My mom's front tire blew out once, and she "felt someone steer the car off the road."
This one's different, far from a house, it can be practically anything or anyone, except of your mom having an illusory feeling. (most of drivers doesn't have illusions, otherwise they're not drivers anymore) A pull of a steering wheel in the direction of a broken tire can be a good explanation here. If the tire was on the opposite side, well, there's a lot of helpful spirits around, which can help, if that accident is not necessary to settle up that person's bad karma.
Tell your mom to use a tires without a tire-tube. When they get pierced, they don't suddenly blow up, but slowly lose the air, so there's a lot of time to pull over.

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