Donate your mind to space exploration!
Imagine, for a moment, if so many years in the future mankind is able to completely interface the brain with a robotic body that either has the capability of providing it with everything it needs or supplants the brain with an artificial one. Furthermore, imagine that there is a system similar to the organ donation program whereby you can volunteer for post-mortuum service either in the military, space exploration, or other hazardous jobs and have the government pay for your new body in addition to maitenence for a given period of time (more or less the amount of time it would take for you to pay off said equipment and relevant costs).
Is this something you would agree to?
(To whom this applies) How does this sit with your notion of an afterlife?
Do you think you would be more willing to sacrifice yourself for the good of mankind after your natural lifespan has ended?
Would you trade your retirement for this kind of option?
Is this something you would approve of your children signing up for?
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"...For in that sleep, what dreams may come. When we hath shuffled off this mortal coil..."
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I'm not sure I would be a willing participant in such a program, even giving the governing body the benefit of the doubt and presuming them to be benign. Effectively, I'd have to surrender my ability to dissent - which I would never be completely comfortable doing.
My children would be free to do as they please.
- Leon Trotsky, Last Will & Testament
February 27, 1940
so am i to understand you want us to be something like this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7duM62eArGI
My first thought is: SWEET! My brain, used in the future...it would be like a 2nd chance at life ! But I wonder that would be like. What part of the brain would the robot interface with? Lets assume the government wants nothing to do with the part of the brain that deals with memory. They rewire/program the brain to shut that function off What if by some malfunction I remember something...everything?
Could you imagine one of these robots being in the middle of manual labor on Mars 200 years from now and "plugging in" to your memory banks? Would it be like some sort of awakening? How frightening! And I am going to go a bit Bradbury on this (assuming the govt. really doesn't want 'thinking' robots...at least beyond the robots task) and wonder if said robot is discovered to be more then just the machine completing the task, would it be destroyed/re programmed? Sounds like a bit of hell to me but I have one heck of an imagination.
Slowly building a blog at ~
http://obsidianwords.wordpress.com/
It's an interesting proposition. I'm reading a book series right now where an entire species of people committed themselves to a ritual whereby they would live, essentially forever, as long as even a single member of another species lived. The members of the immortal race have endured for some 200,000 years in the book's timeline. Some people have gone insane. Some people want only death or an end. Some of them remain stedfastly committed to the purpose of the ritual. Some of them feel as though they had no choice and may even have not wanted to be included in the ritual. Some of them have turned away from the purpose to seek a purpose of their own in their eternal lives.
I like to think that undergoing such a proceedure would be noble. I like to think that I would be patient in my new life, awaiting the end of service, nobly rendered, so that I could pursue some other purpose. I like to think that I could be well-adjusted. I like to think those things, but I think another reality would pass. The work would chafe me. I would be witness to the unwavering folly of humanity, the essential repetition of history. My work would seem ultimitely worthless. Futile in the bigger picture such long existence would paint more detailed for me. I would be jaded. My capacity for emotion would dwindle to bitterness and cynicism. I would be hardened. I would seek an end; for what purpose could there be to such an existence? All that unless such apparently naive optimism when I undergo the proceedure is actually well placed. I like to think that could be the case too and so I could never undergo such a proceedure.
BigUniverse wrote,
"Well the things that happen less often are more likely to be the result of the supper natural. A thing like loosing my keys in the morning is not likely supper natural, but finding a thousand dollars or meeting a celebrity might be."
My robot's going to have the strength of five GO-rillas!
As long as I don't go all Robocop 2 on people where I need drugs in order to retain my sanity and not go postal, then it should be just fine.
Sounds like something Doomed Soul would like.
Heheh, yeah. We seem to have similar hopes for the future.
I've had arrangements for cryonic suspension (neuro option) with the Alcor Foundation since 1990. This sounds like an interesting option for my "second life" (not the silly online version).
BTW, regarding the "afterlife," what if scientists can establish empirically that an afterlife exists, but also that it doesn't last forever? How would religions based on forever-beliefs respond?
Some of them might argue that an after-afterlife exists, inhabited by the ghosts of departed ghosts.
I would imagine that some of them would deny it. They could also dub it "pergatory."
OK, do you have any expectations of the world that you might wake up in?
I ask that because Larry Niven has written many novels based on that premise and pretty much none of them would be a good future to live in. His main series that uses cryogenic preservation is not about space travel (although it does exist in that future) but of what happens when medicine can cure essentially everything given the raw materials. It is basically a dystopia where body parts are harvested not only from the “corpsicles” (such as yourself) but also from convicted criminals. And that world is so freaking overpopulated that there is a huge black market for body parts and also a criminal justice system that imposes a death penalty by organ harvest for what we would consider trivial crimes.
That aside, he does have another series where the corpsicles are used as pilots for interstellar travel. It was this series that I was going to write about before I saw your post. Basically, this future world has the ability to copy a mind from one body to another but the process is destructive, so you only get one chance.
Also, they are colonizing the galaxy with sub light speed ships. This of course requires pilots who are willling to head off into the great unknown never to have contact with humanity again. So what they do is take convicted murderers, wipe their brains and copy the mind of a corpsicle into them. Then they run the person through a battery of tests to see if they really were willing to throw themselves into an unknown future or were just afraid of dying.
Those who were afraid of dying basically have never been able to adapt to the future totalitarian world that does this to people so they get wiped and they try again with a new corpsicle mind. When they find one that is useful, they train him to be a starship pilot and then send him off never to return. Mind you, with the technology which is available by this point, living for thousands of years is not much of a problem, so when you find a suitable world to develop, you get to be the official representative of the government while a new culture develops.
Here is basically how it could play out for you:
You are lying in your hospital bed dying. Then in what seems like a couple of minutes for you, you are awake and healthy. However, you are not in your own body. Once things have been explained to you, you are run through a lengthy series of psychological tests. Potentially several months worth. If you survive that process (and most people don't), you get sent off to pilot training. Eventually, you get a ship of your own where your only companionship is an intelligent computer that has to obey you.
At relativistic velocities, a trip of ten light years would take twenty of your years and a trip across the whole galaxy would take about thirty of your years. Not too bad if you can stand the solitude. Of course you only get to that point if you really can but whatever.
Eventually, you will find a world worth setting up a colony on and you will start the process of terra-forming it before deploying your cargo of frozen embryos of all the species that were sent with you, including humans. Then you get to interact with them from the point of view of being their benevolent sky daddy and dictator. Pretty much, you would function as their god.
Is that the type of thing that you want?
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Actually, it sounds mind-numbingly boring to me. I'd think by that time we'd have the technology to put everyone on the ship into a state of cryogenic sleep and the technology to set the ship up with sensors to detect conditions on any planets and would also have a pretty good idea of what systems would have a "class M" planet (yeah, I liked Star Trek). Once a planet was found, or if something went wrong on the ship requiring someone's attention, you could be brought out of the cryogenic sleep.
I think we will see a time when the human body will be successfully integrated with artificial limbs. There is already some success with prosthesis devices being developed today. These are not exactly integrated with the nervouse system of the body but I think one day it'll happen. Now that, I wouldn't mind. There was a series of science-fantasy books called "Shadowrun" a few years ago based on a board game of the same name where science had developed to that point. People could even plug their minds into the internet and I think we might even see that happen sometime in the future.
As far as having my brain implanted into a robotic body... I think I'd rather take an eternity of oblivion. At least I wouldn't be bored. I wouldn't be anything.
"Erecting the 'wall of separation between church and state,' therefore, is absolutely essential in a free society." Thomas Jefferson
www.myspace.com/kenhill5150
Yeah, but it will only be 5 feet tall...
Well, in the context of the Larry Niven novels, if you can't hack twenty plus years alone in a starship, then you would be brain wiped and they would try someone else. So perhaps freezing might not be an option for you.
Here too, you miss on the Larry Niven model. They can't put a living person into cryo-sleep. So you would have to be awake the whole time. In any case, the cargo was frozen embryos. However, if it does turn out to be possible to use cryo-sleep, then there would be no reason to use corpsicles as pilots. One would simply keep the pilot in suspended animation for the duration. Heck but he could go where he wanted to, do his job and then come back.
The only problem with that idea is that he might be returning upwards of a few hundred thousand years after he left. This was a problem that was covered in the Larry Niven novels as one pilot did come back to earth three million years later, only to find that the world he had left was not what he found on arrival.
Since you seem to like sci-fi, I would suggest that you start with “A World out of Time” By Niven and then move onto “The Integral Trees” also by Niven.
As far as detecting extra-solar planets goes, yes we can do that. To date, we have found one that might actually be viable for life as we know it. Perhaps in a thousand years, we will have a whole catalog of places that are worth sending a starship to.
Even so, you are really underestimating the limits of knowledge of the galaxy. We have reached a point with science in general where we know what the limits of knowledge in general are and the fact is that there are vast sections of the galaxy that we cannot see unless we go there.
Let me make this very clear: I have no clue what the future of a thousand years from now will look like. However, I can state with confidence that if we can do the things that sci-fi predicts, we will still have to explore the galaxy.
OK, I have no real problem with that idea. In fact, the people who do try to make somewhat reasonable guesses about the future seem to think that we might be as little as twenty years away from being able to copy whatever makes a human special into a computer.
So it is theoretically possible that I will live to see the world a thousand years from now. I really don't know if I want to do that but given the chance to make a copy of myself that can live as long as I wish to, I don't really see a problem with making the copy in the first place.
If I decide that I have had enough of life after 500 years, then I hope that the fundies are not around then to tell me that I must not do so because it is somehow a violation of the biblical prohibition on suicide.
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I actually did read "A World Out of Time", back about 1977 or '78. Niven is a good writer and I probably should pick up some of his books now and start reading them. I was more into writers like Poul Anderson, Asimov, Heinlein, Clarke and others at that time.
My point really was that I would be bored out of my mind. Solitude is not something I mind, however, solitude without anything to stimulate my mind would drive me nuts. I'd rather they wiped my mind from the corpsicle. If I could be put into a state of suspended animation or cryogenic sleep I could go for that.
While I understand he wrote that from the perspective of mind-swapping, so to speak, being the scientific accomplishment of the time. I was simply stepping into the current reality of technilogical advances and I think we are much closer to creating a hybrid man-machine than being able to transfer the mind of a person into a corpse that would also have to be re-animated.
I think the target time frame of 20 years for a self aware computer is probably about right. There are computer programs now that allow a computer to "think" and "evolve". Self-awareness has not been accomplished as yet in a program but experts in the field are working on it.
(http://www.ur.umich.edu/9293/Mar22_93/3.htm)
I agree with you, I don't think I'd want to see what the world will be like in a thousand years. Especially if christian dominionists do manage to take over the government. I think, however, if that happens the world and life on it will probably be destroyed with the damned jeebus freaks trying to hasten the rapture. That might not be a bad thing, though, except for the people who have to go through it. Maybe the planet would escape the mistakes of the past and keep life stupid and unimaginative so intelligent creatures couldn't destroy it again. There I go, anthropomorphizing again.
"Erecting the 'wall of separation between church and state,' therefore, is absolutely essential in a free society." Thomas Jefferson
www.myspace.com/kenhill5150
Sign me up
Keep in mind I'm not talking the FAR future here. More like not-quite-out-of-the-immediate-solar-system era. So if you were working for NASA you might be sent to Mars, one of Jupiter's moons, or somewhere in the asteroid belt. You'd likely be building habitats, terraforming, mining for resources, etc. You know, the kinds of things that make human colonization possible.
Or, you could go into fairly hazardous areas such as semi-active volcanos or deep sea areas. Places where sending a robot might be more ideal but impractical, for whatever reason - likely swift complex decision making. Or you could be an onsite supervisor for a whole set of robots, working in a less hazardous area while the robots do the kinds of things that have a good chance of destroying them.
... YES
Oh... that sounds exactly like a Dreadnought, some poor mutilated sap of a space marine, forever on life support, locked in a coffin, with a mechwarrior built around it. Ya, i'd SO do it.
Pretty much what every one in "Ghost in a Shell" was operating under. Service to the (Japanese? ) Government until such time as the costs were pay in full.
Again, YES
Khorne might be mad that he'll never have my skull... but... i would be eternally taking skulls in his name >.> so i think it evens out.
... err... "good"? >.> <.< .... huh? oh oh yes, yes Good... yes
Yes
... children? me? ... any government that would allow ME to have this proceedure AND have children... EVER... should seriously rethink its policies >.>
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Either, or, I dont care... just get me out of this meatbag!
What Would Kharn Do?