Is there a single decent page in the Bible?

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Is there a single decent page in the Bible?

If you open the Bible randomly can you find a single page that is not meaningless (a begat b etc), morally horrifying (bible "heroes" doing questionable things) or obsequious (praise and nothing but the praise).

In short, is there a single page in the bible that is actually a good promotion for the religion? (I'm talking about a whole page, not a one-liner)

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First 'book' that comes in

First 'book' that comes in mind is Esther ~  

 

**edit** seems to be one book in the bible that doesn't mention 'god'

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I think Solomon's Song could

I think Solomon's Song could be in this list as well as many proverbs.

A 'good promotion for the religion' should include some religious words, shouldn't it?

 


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Uuuhh, some of the Jesus

Uuuhh, some of the Jesus stuff is pretty nice. Psalms and Proverbs have some good things to say. I couldn't remember what Esther was about, so I looked in my Bible and that didn't seem too bad. Um, I kind of like the book of Job because I like Job. Yahweh is as big a douchebag as he usually is though.

Edit: A whole page!?..............eh, how big are your pages? Lol.

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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Dude

 

I have a KJV my mum bought me with all the things jesus said highlighted in red.

The best page in this is at the back after revelations where there is one completely blank page.

In the wake of so much bullshit, it's really profound.

 

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There are some pages in

There are some pages in Esther where the Jews don't do much harm (except being arrogant and declaring that they have their own law and won't follow the king's law, thus causing themselves problems). They do start start smiting people with swords around 9:5 though. They kill at least 800.

It is interesting that God isn't specifically mentioned for once.

This is all just for curiosity, mind you. Most Bible quotes are taken out of sections that are horrifying when the whole thing is read, or boring (just going on about how great God is with no point). The Bible heroes all seem to be murderers and assholes.

I was thinking about how stupid the book is and was wondering if there is an actual section you can read in which God seems nice without being an asshole.

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Solomon's Song seems to be

Solomon's Song seems to be another book with no mention of God. The way I read it, it is a quite saucy love song with some lesbian bits in it.

Definitely fills the bill of nothing offensive, but nothing about religion either.

As far as Proverbs go, could you be more specific? I don't have time to read the whole book at thte moment.

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New Testiment? Could you be

New Testiment? Could you be more specific please? I remember most of Jesus bits as him going around purposefully doing things that fulfil the prophecies. He does nice stuff but says some shit stuff...

In Job God was an asshole...

My pages are pretty small, but so is the writing. It is an old KJV that I inherited from my Grandfather, two columns of writing to a page, looks pretty standard.

My sample size suggestion was arbitrary, maybe we should go by chapters.

 

... I just read a random page from Proverbs and I think it fits the bill (not that I really know what I am looking for, just curious)... Chapter 3 seems ok.

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Jesus said, "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division." - Luke 12:51


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 Quote:Is there a single

 

Quote:
Is there a single decent page in the Bible?

From my recollection I'm going to have to go with "no."  I used to have more fun with Rook picking a page in the bible and forcing ourselves to find a contradiction.  I don't remember us finding a page in which between the two of us we couldn't find a contradiction either on that page or on some other page.

 

 

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 Sapient wrote: Quote:Is

 

Sapient wrote:

 

Quote:
Is there a single decent page in the Bible?

From my recollection I'm going to have to go with "no."  I used to have more fun with Rook picking a page in the bible and forcing ourselves to find a contradiction.  I don't remember us finding a page in which between the two of us we couldn't find a contradiction either on that page or on some other page.

 

 

id have to agree 


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Quote:From my recollection

Quote:
From my recollection I'm going to have to go with "no."  I used to have more fun with Rook picking a page in the bible and forcing ourselves to find a contradiction.  I don't remember us finding a page in which between the two of us we couldn't find a contradiction either on that page or on some other page.

Well, a single page of Song of Solomon might only be contradicted by other books, so that might fit the OP's criteria.  I don't recall SoS extolling and then condemning sex in the same passage.   

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I still think that the story

I still think that the story of the Good Samaritan is a nice humanistic passage.
Jesus is teaching and a man asks what he must do to get into the kingdom of God.
Jesus asks if he follows the 10 commandments and the man says he has done since he was a boy.
Jesus is impressed and says that there are 2 more to add:
Love God and Love his Neighbour.

The man then asks who is his neighbour.
Jesus then tells the story of a business man who gets beaten half to death by robbers.
A priest passes, and quickly carries on before he gets attacked too.
A pharisee (another religious pharisee) does similar.
Then comes a Samaritan. (Jesus' audience gasps because the Samaritan non-Jewish - like a heathen or possibly even an atheist)
Jesus describes how the Samaritan takes time to care for the man and even spends money on hospital treatment.

He then finishes the story and asks his audience who the beaten man's neighbour was.
Nobody chooses the religious characters in the story.


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Yes, that Jesus dude seems

Yes, that Jesus dude seems like a prety cool guy.


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But he nevertheless

 

Can't help himself in mark when he starts ranting about lakes of fire...

Having read the gospels repeatedly I can't help believing that jesus is fabricated. He has no true depth of character and his teachings are consistently erratic.

And just when you want to him to insist he's god he comes out with: "That is what you say."

It's not much of an effort from the son of the living god.

 

 

 

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I don't think so..

ronin-dog wrote:

If you open the Bible randomly can you find a single page that is not meaningless (a begat b etc), morally horrifying (bible "heroes" doing questionable things) or obsequious (praise and nothing but the praise).

In short, is there a single page in the bible that is actually a good promotion for the religion? (I'm talking about a whole page, not a one-liner)

I have found more morality in an issue of Hustler than I have th bible.. You have incest, the killing of your only son, the torture and degredation of your truest follower (JOB), angel rapers (story of Sodom and Gommorah), and eternal damnation if you don't believe. These are just a few examples of the useless nonsense that is the bible..

"There is no God higher than truth." -Mahatma Ghandi


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Atheistextremist wrote:Can't

Atheistextremist wrote:

Can't help himself in mark when he starts ranting about lakes of fire...

I didn't say he was perfect. After all, Gandhi was a racist but that doesn't mean he wasn't a prety cool guy.


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Sure - there are elements

 

of his alleged character that are cool.

The walking on water thing was a really cool idea. Whoever thought of that one, well done, you. 


 

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Best way

By asking this question, you show that you did not read the bible.

That is not really a problem of course, but I think the best way to answer your question about finding a decent page is to read for yourself.

Now you are stuck with the personal opinions of all responders, who all have different ideas about ´decent´.

I think there is more decent in the Bible than people want to believe. You must put the bible in the context of the time when a specific part was written. Knowing that the books of the bible were written in a period of 1600 years, there is no such thing as ´the time when the bible was written´. Look how different our world is compared to 10 or 20 years ago.

Having said this, large parts of the bible are just history. Of course it is mixed wih religion, because that is the only reference and framework that existed in the country of which it tells the history.

It starts with the history of the earth and heaven - you may doubt the historicity of that part. Smiling However, its only the first few pages of the bible.

The rest of the book of genesis handles with the ´birth´ of the nation of Israel (=another name for Jacob, the grandson of Abraham). The next four books describe the exodus from Egypt, the travel through the desert and the giving of the law by Moses. You may not agree with these laws and commandments, but the stories in between are just historical - What happened and when did it happen and who was involved. Another era is described in Judges which is basically: This nation captured Israel for this many years and then a judge was born and freed the people of Israel. This happens a few times and then Israel wants to have a king. This is a new era and therefore a new book is started. First two books of Samuel describing the life of the first two kings, then two books of Kings, describing the history of the north and south parts of the country of Israel. After that there are two books of Chronicles which basically tell the same as Kings, but only for the south part. All these books just tell who was king and what did he do. Whether the king was religious or not does not say anything about the accuracy of the author. Persons, occasions and cities have often been verified by modern science.

After this history, there are some prophets included. You will probably not agree with what they say, but the author did a good job recording what he heard these ´messengers of god´ say.

The new testament starts with the life of Jesus and after that the actions of the apostles in the first 30 years after Jesus. Writers of these books could have been eye witness to the things that they describe. maybe the theological part is a bit old fashioned, but the authors just wrote down what they heard Jesus or the apostles say. Especially the book of Acts seems to be accurate, since there are several ´we´ passages with no reason to doubt that the author really was there.

Then a set of letters from apostle Paul to churches or persons appears. Modern day scientists do not doubt the authenticity of any of these letters as written by Paul, except for one - Hebrews.

In my opinion - whether or not accepting the theological part of the text - you should agree that the history of the Jews was recorded very accurately over the course of time. The books about which people have the most doubts are Genesis, Job, Psalms, the prophets and Revelation/Apocalypse. The rest actually seems quite okay.

Compare it with the history of your own country. How many decent pages will you find there if you exclude the ones with religious words?


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I think there is little or

I think there is little or no archeological or historical evidence for the Israelites in Egypt, the Exodus, and the wandering in the desert.

 

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Given the bible

eighth wrote:

By asking this question, you show that you did not read the bible.

That is not really a problem of course, but I think the best way to answer your question about finding a decent page is to read for yourself.

Now you are stuck with the personal opinions of all responders, who all have different ideas about ´decent´.

I think there is more decent in the Bible than people want to believe. You must put the bible in the context of the time when a specific part was written. Knowing that the books of the bible were written in a period of 1600 years, there is no such thing as ´the time when the bible was written´. Look how different our world is compared to 10 or 20 years ago.

Having said this, large parts of the bible are just history. Of course it is mixed wih religion, because that is the only reference and framework that existed in the country of which it tells the history.

It starts with the history of the earth and heaven - you may doubt the historicity of that part. Smiling However, its only the first few pages of the bible.

The rest of the book of genesis handles with the ´birth´ of the nation of Israel (=another name for Jacob, the grandson of Abraham). The next four books describe the exodus from Egypt, the travel through the desert and the giving of the law by Moses. You may not agree with these laws and commandments, but the stories in between are just historical - What happened and when did it happen and who was involved. Another era is described in Judges which is basically: This nation captured Israel for this many years and then a judge was born and freed the people of Israel. This happens a few times and then Israel wants to have a king. This is a new era and therefore a new book is started. First two books of Samuel describing the life of the first two kings, then two books of Kings, describing the history of the north and south parts of the country of Israel. After that there are two books of Chronicles which basically tell the same as Kings, but only for the south part. All these books just tell who was king and what did he do. Whether the king was religious or not does not say anything about the accuracy of the author. Persons, occasions and cities have often been verified by modern science.

After this history, there are some prophets included. You will probably not agree with what they say, but the author did a good job recording what he heard these ´messengers of god´ say.

The new testament starts with the life of Jesus and after that the actions of the apostles in the first 30 years after Jesus. Writers of these books could have been eye witness to the things that they describe. maybe the theological part is a bit old fashioned, but the authors just wrote down what they heard Jesus or the apostles say. Especially the book of Acts seems to be accurate, since there are several ´we´ passages with no reason to doubt that the author really was there.

Then a set of letters from apostle Paul to churches or persons appears. Modern day scientists do not doubt the authenticity of any of these letters as written by Paul, except for one - Hebrews.

In my opinion - whether or not accepting the theological part of the text - you should agree that the history of the Jews was recorded very accurately over the course of time. The books about which people have the most doubts are Genesis, Job, Psalms, the prophets and Revelation/Apocalypse. The rest actually seems quite okay.

Compare it with the history of your own country. How many decent pages will you find there if you exclude the ones with religious words?

 

Is largely dedicated to recounting the actions of an unprovable, undefinable god, it's hard to agree that so many books in the bible "actually seem quite ok".

There's a seam of impossibility running through all of them that can't be ignored regardless of whether or not historians generally agree that this is a very old delusion.

 

P.S. Good and balanced reply though - I especially admire use of the words "In my opinion".

 

 

 

 

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Eighth...

Actually I have read large parts of the Bible, not all of it though, hence my question.

My question was actually not aimed at the accuracy of the Bible, so I won't talk about that here. What I was getting at is that the Bible is the one and only text of Christianity, and it is supposed to be the selling point as well. From what I have read of the Bible it is not particularly nice and God and his chosen people don't come accross very well. A lot of it is just plain crazy. The heroes of the Bible that Christians get watered down versions of in Sunday school are actually pretty nasty if you read the whole story.

I started this post just out of curiosity, to see if there were any sections I had missed that were better than what I have already read. My point is actually that I can't find any redeamable features in the bible that would convince anyone to want to believe in it.

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Jesus said, "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division." - Luke 12:51


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i guess it depends on what

i guess it depends on what you mean by "decent."  if you mean morally decent by our modern, mostly pacifistic standards then perhaps not.

if, however, you mean historically (as in textual and mythological history) or poetically "decent," then for a guy like me who studied three dead languages (latin and biblical hebrew and greek) as well as the whole history of judaism, christianity, and the ancient and classical mediterranean, then hell yes, i have to say this book kicks ass, just like homer, lucan, and moses cordovero all kick ass.  in a literary and philosophical sense, the bible a cornerstone of the development of human thought, and in this sense i have profound respect for it, especially the torah.

i just think it's wack-o to live by its every word, just like it would be wack-o to live by every word of hesiod or the laws of manu.

then again, can anyone think of any book whose every word you'd live by?

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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iwbiek wrote:i guess it

iwbiek wrote:

i guess it depends on what you mean by "decent."  if you mean morally decent by our modern, mostly pacifistic standards then perhaps not.

if, however, you mean historically (as in textual and mythological history) or poetically "decent," then for a guy like me who studied three dead languages (latin and biblical hebrew and greek) as well as the whole history of judaism, christianity, and the ancient and classical mediterranean, then hell yes, i have to say this book kicks ass, just like homer, lucan, and moses cordovero all kick ass.  in a literary and philosophical sense, the bible a cornerstone of the development of human thought, and in this sense i have profound respect for it, especially the torah.

i just think it's wack-o to live by its every word, just like it would be wack-o to live by every word of hesiod or the laws of manu.

then again, can anyone think of any book whose every word you'd live by?

No I didn't really mean from a mythological or poetical point of view. More from a "what positive do people see in it' point of view, going by whole sections, not just one-liners.

Mythologically it is great, it has provided the foundation for a lot of cool stories just like other ancient myths have.

Of course I can't think of any book whose every word I would live by. That's kind of the point. No one should be trying to live their lives based on some ancient work of fiction, and yet millions of people do.

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Bible

I have read the entire bible, and agree that instead of drawing you in it tends more to repel with one atrocity after another.

Always found it very interesting that though it is supposed to be the inspired word of God, an omniscient, omnipresent being...it reveals NOTHING that was not know by the people at the time it was written.  Did God have nothing more to share from his huge well of knowledge?  Nothing about germ theory?  Electricity? Geography? Astronomy?

Has been too long ago that we discovered the world wasn't flat.  And we only figured out that disease came from germs 150 years ago.

Isn't that a little suspicious?

Vicki


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Literary and philosophical

Literary and philosophical merit? Perhaps.

 

That doesn't require any actual real knowledge or understanding. "Philosophical" doesn't count for much with me.

 

Don't quite get what "textual and mythological history" refers to.

It is a record of the myths they believed in, and some probably inaccurate description of other peoples myths.

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BobSpence1 wrote:Literary

BobSpence1 wrote:

Literary and philosophical merit? Perhaps.

 

That doesn't require any actual real knowledge or understanding. "Philosophical" doesn't count for much with me.

fair enough.  i could take part in a two-day symposium on the disputed origins of the cult of the magna mater and its implications for the theory of the human unconscious and never once check my watch, while a single 45-minute biology lesson might very well put me to sleep.  i'm just poetically wired.  to each his own.

BobSpence1 wrote:

Don't quite get what "textual and mythological history" refers to.

the history of the development of ancient texts and the history of the development of mythology.

BobSpence1 wrote:

It is a record of the myths they believed in, and some probably inaccurate description of other peoples myths.

i suppose, though when you talk about mythology it's a bit dangerous to try to put things in terms of "accuracy."  ancient people of almost every civilization held contradictory beliefs simultaneously, believing (quite wisely) that they didn't have the whole picture of the truth.  most ancient semites had no problem believing in yahweh and astarte at the same time.  in fact it was probably goddesses like astarte that later became embodied in kabbalistic concepts of the shekhinah.  homer, hesiod, appolodorus, and ovid all give us contradictory accounts of the creation of the world and the genealogy of the pantheon, and all four were held in reverence in the classical world, along with zarathustra and those "atheistic" neoplatonists like plotinus.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson