Help! I'm experiencing some strange feelings
Offline Greetings and thank you for reading my post! The thread title is dubious, but read on, I think you'll be able to empathize. I want to say now that I owe a debt of gratitude to this community for beating some sense into me in the past, and I'm hopeful you will help me again. If you want to say something "insulting" towards my problem please do so, it helped before! 
But that said please be constructive in some manner. Anyway:
I have very recently decided to embrace agnosticism and am glad I'm opening doors towards better views and a more unbiased outlook. Now this said, I am having some strange feeling of guilt the last couple of days... It's very confusing for me. I don't know what's up, but it sorta feels like I'm abandoning precious beliefs I once held. To be clear, one single omnipotent God has always existed as what I worshiped, and nothing else. It has provided a good role model in my mind to be honest! I've spent a lot of my life figuring stuff like "God is omnipotent and the perfect role model to do our best to both worship and mimick, though micmiking entirely is impossible". As an agnostic I don't say to myself that God for certain does not exist nor not exist. I suppose the idea of a perfect role model to attempt to copy is still in my mind as being a good thing. (I do feel a desire to be an atheist after reading much of the forums though, so I'm coming along nicely imo. 
)
Anyway, I'm really wondering where this is coming from and I think this feeling of false guilt may be from a few things. I honestly don't know! But I have a few hypotheses. One being I am torn between the dichotomy of denouncing any form of belief in God, as opposed to entertaining my old thoughts of my "role model" as legitimate and good. Am I making sense?
I also think the feelings of guilt are at least in part because theists love to shove it down other people's throats that they are guilty. Of course atheists are guilty of nothing, in fact it's the opposite I'm sure, but it's hard to internalize this considering these social norms have been pushed on me for so very long.
There's also this... I wonder, if God does exist, am I committing an injustice by not acknowledging him? If God does exist then it would hypothetically be the ethical thing to exalt the one who created me etc, would it not? Writing out my problem seems to be helping me by the way...
I know that I hold better beliefs on what is ethical than a large percent of theists. I suppose it's some kind of deist and personal beliefs are really what is bothering me at the moment. When I was a theist I believed that all would be forgiven in time, including people who are "evil". I'm not sure what I'm internalizing right now but I guess it's a fight between right and wrong going on in my head...
I really want to stop these guilty feelings, they seem centered in irrationality. I just don't get it. I'd appreciate some wisdom. 
Sorry for being a big wuss and repetitive lol. I will make it up one day with a donation to RRS I swear! (Current finances = bleh.) I don't know what would help me right now, there's plenty of great atheist people shitting all over irrationality on this site but it doesn't seem to help so much; perhaps someone(s) can offer something that is like that but applied to my different problem?
I really appreciate that you personally read what I had to say. I'd like to say that the biggest reason I posted this is because I can't be the only one like this. I imagine a lot of people have the same or similar problems when it concerns all sorts of imposed beliefs; this one just seems exceptionally hard to tackle
Best wishes RRS, I hope we can figure out how to better battle the bad elements of human nature. I am now going to start drinking liquor and see if that helps hehe. 
Much love.
I never thought there were corners in my mind until I was told to stand in one.
I have learned so much, thanks for keeping it real RRS.
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I think this "strange feeling" you're talking about is your brain working.
My solution is simple...
Kill the Cricket, Stop the Guilt
LOL! You're onto something, but guilt?
And thanks TDS that was good as well.
I really hope we can all learn the intricacies of how the brain and thought works. I'm usually the stoic type believe it or not but I thought some good would come from my emo post. :p
I never thought there were corners in my mind until I was told to stand in one.
I have learned so much, thanks for keeping it real RRS.
You know, that reminds of a intense experience I had back in 2000. Not like yours in itself, but seemed to have been brought on by some small nagging feeling of not exactly doubt, but maybe I was wrong to completely dismiss religious ideas.
The intense experience itself seemed to be a final resolution, a purging of that nagging question, leading to really strong positive feeling of finally 'getting it'.
I already described it to one of our Theist participants, as an example of how even us non-believers could have experiences of the same general nature as they frequently describe as confirming their beliefs, as a message from God, or Jesus, etc.
The content of such feelings was the same in the sense of a strong affirmation of your basic beliefs, whether in the existence of God or the existence of a world without God.
IOW, they were in no way proof of the beliefs, just a consequence of the belief.
I recount this because it seemed to show that even after decades of confident Atheism, as far as I could tell, there was still something like what you describe , lurking back there.
Whether it was a feeling that had seeped in there from the continual confrontation with God belief around me in society, or just something from way back that had never fully died, even though I never as far as I can remember really took God seriously.
So if I can have that, you, as an only recently emerged non-believer, or at least serious doubter, are far more more likely to experience something similar and stronger.
I think your sub-conscious hasn't quite worked thru all the arguments....
So don't give up.
Maybe you will have your 'epiphany'. It certainly felt great at the time.
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"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
Here's my guess: it's just the fragments, habits, and thoughts from your old beliefs.
It takes a while to move from intellectual acceptance to fully integrating that into your life. What you are feeling is emotional inertia. And ironically, it's also the last bit of your old beliefs trying to sow doubt. "What if god does exist?" it says, with echoes of Pascal. (That's ironic because that's what agnosticism is all about -- admitting there's no way to know whether or not god exists -- doubt in its purest form.)
I understand this guilt can last quite a while. It might even pull you back into your old beliefs.
Do you believe this guilt is good? Does it serve a noble purpose? If it is a leftover from your old faith, what does it say about the old faith?
"Yes, I seriously believe that consciousness is a product of a natural process. I find that the neuroscientists, psychologists, and philosophers who proceed from that premise are the ones who are actually making useful contributions to our understanding of the mind." - PZ Myers
For me, the process wasn't as dramatic. All throughout my church-going days as a kid, I don't think I ever really "bought it." I sorta assumed the god thing was true, but then learned I really just needed to keep quiet to get cookies. I'd try to avoid church as much as possible because I thought it was boring, redundant and seemed like a place to listen to obviously tone deaf people "sing" and then ask for our money. Don't judge people! But why are you wearing THAT to church, check out my new shoes... blah blah blah.
Later on I'd actually thought, well let's see.. I was only in that church because my parents brought me there, and NEVER went on my own. What if there's a better one? After all.. now I could choose anything. So I started reading.. and couldn't find a compelling case why ones were particularly better than others. Seems like most everyone just "chose" whatever their regional/family tradition already was. After wiping the board clean and trying to start over, I kinda preferred the clean board. I couldn't find compelling arguments TO believe anything or pick anything, so I was drawn more toward checking out arguments that supported "nothing." (or REALLY HIGHLY PROBABLY nothing)
At that point, once I'd churned through and understood the points, I couldn't both be honest with myself and a believer.
Guilty for not believing? Never.
I think Bob is right, in that your sub-conscious doesn't quite have the hang of rationality yet. Intellectually, you can look at beliefs and see, "Yeah, that's crap." But subconsiously, there's still the feeling of truthiness there. I think this is a somewhat common reaction in people who are recently deconverted. Several people on this forum have said that they have or had lingering fears of hell, even after they were thoroughly intellectually convinced that the whole idea was absurd. And yet, the fear remained.
So, I think the same thing is going on with you. You have this worn, cut path in your brain of thinking about the 'ultimate role model', and you likely have some old rationalizations kicking around in there from when you used to believe.
For me, the way to break out of these subconscious patterns of thought is to constantly scrutinize them until I finally get an epiphany. The way I do it is like this: "Well, how do I really know that?" "Maybe because of X?" "Hmmm, naw. Nope, that doesn't make sense." "But it still seems true." "Well, how do I really know that?" "Maybe because of Y?" "Nope, I debunked that one last week." "But it still seems true." "Well, how do I really know that?" Etc.
It's that pernicious question of "How do I really know that?" which I keep asking myself over and over again, trying to find holes in my beliefs. Until finally, one day, I 'get it':
"Well, how do I really know that?" "Hmmmm... I guess... I don't."
Bang!
"Holy crap! I *don't* know that. I have no reason to believe it. I never did! The whole thing was just self-deception. Pretending to know what I really didn't."
This is a big epiphany process for me. On the surface, it seems like I've broken down something, and I should be sad that something has broken. But really, the only thing that is broken is fear! Fear of being wrong. Fear of the consequences of not holding on to some 'precious' belief. But the 'precious', like the One Ring that Gollum calls 'precious' in the Lord of the Ring, is really just a mental shackle, a trap, a cage.
When I break that fear, I haven't lost anything, I've gained a tremendous freedom! Wow, there really is no hell! Nothing to fear. Wow, there really isn't anything wrong with people being homosexual! No need to fear them. Wow, there really aren't separate races! Wow, there really isn't some impossible-to-live-up-to ideal role-model! I can just be myself, and there's nothing wrong with that. Nothing to fear.
Now, right at this moment, you may be feeling that the ultimate role-model isn't such a bad thing. It's comforting. It feels safe. If such a thing exists, then it provides a solid ground to stand on. But that feeling of safety, though it *feels* positive, is really based on fear. The fear is "What if I don't have that safety?!" And that fear is too much, so you cling desperately to the irrational belief, even though you know intellectually that it doesn't make sense.
When I say, 'breaking the fear', it may sound like 'giving up the comfort', but no, it really is a breaking of a fear. The comfort is in response to your avoiding the fear. The fear is keeping you stuck, and the comfort is really just 'the easy path'.
When you break these irrational beliefs, the alternative is not something to be afraid of. The fear is an illusion. That's why we want to break it.
The alternative is actually much better, and more free. Freedom of thought. How truly precious that is -- much more precious than a 'precious' belief clung to in fear.
So, with that preamble in mind, let's examine your fears, and ask, "How do you really know that?" The goal is the epiphany, "Holy crap! You really don't!" With that epiphany, your subconscious will finally 'get' what your intellectual mind already can see.
Does that still 'feel true'? How do you really know that? Examine that. You've spent a lot of your life coming up with these kinds of rationalizations. The thought-tracks in your subconscious are deep ruts. You want to work your thought patterns out of those ruts. What do you find compelling about this idea of a perfect, but impossible role-model? Then ask, "How do I really know that?" If the role-model is so impossible, then wouldn't God itself be impossible? If it's not actually impossible, could it really be perfect? Is perfection even possible at all? Does it even make sense? Do you know of anything that's perfect? Isn't perfection just an idea, a concept, an invention of the mind? Keep questioning, and working yourself out of your mental ruts. Eventually, you'll break out, and gain more freedom.
How do you really know that? Are you just afraid that you can't act morally on your own, without such a role-model to follow? Is it mentally healthy to hold yourself up to an admittedly impossible standard? Is it really such a good thing to imagine a perfect role model to copy? Doesn't that force you into a mindset where there is only *one* way of being good? After all, you're not imagining two perfect role-models, just one. Maybe the idea of a single perfect role-model actually does more harm than good. How do you really know that it's a good thing? Maybe it's not. Maybe it's bad, in fact. Maybe it pushes people into a mind-set of "I've got the right idea about perfect morality, and you've got the wrong idea." After all, probably my conception of a perfect role-model is different than yours! Who's got the right one?! Doesn't the idea of a single role-model make you become more bigoted and intolerant of differing opinions? It certainly seems to do that with a lot of monotheists I've seen.
Is that really a true dichotomy? How do you really know that? Do you have to renounce any form of belief in God? Or can you simply say, "I just don't have any good reasons to believe in any gods. Maybe if someone showed me good reasons, I would change my mind, but until then, I remain unconvinced." Suddenly, the dichotomy doesn't seem to be very di. Maybe tri, maybe more.
Well, how do you really know that? As long as we're inventing possible gods, maybe if god exists, you're doing an injustice *by* acknowledging him. Sounds just as plausible to me, seeing as how they are both inventions of the human imagination with no reason to believe in either one. Maybe it's a her and not a him. Maybe by acknowledging it, the god is actually losing a bet with his friend Alice, the other god who created the other universe. Maybe this is all a game, a friendly wager, and the contest is to see who can make a universe where it takes the longest for the creatures inside to acknowledge their gods. Our god has managed to go 13.5 billion years without anyone acknowledging him. He was about to break the cosmic record of 13.8 billion years without acknowledgment, and here we humans had to come along and fuck up his game. We just lost god a ton of money.
Likewise, if god exists, then it would *hypothetically* be a totally *unethical* thing to exalt the one who created you, would it not? Key word: hypothetically.
This scenario sounds exactly as plausible to me as Yahweh or Allah or the FSM.
The question, once again, is "How do you really know, one way or the other?" The answer is, you don't.
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Sorry I haven't replied sooner! Thank you very much for your excellent replies. I've reread them a few times during the course of my all nighter and it has helped me a lot. Once again I find myself grateful of RRS.
I'm feeling a lot better right now. All of you said something very eye opening and thoughtful, thank you for caring. 
I've been pondering the advice given all night, and trying to reply well, but it just hasn't come to me yet. I'm confident I'll be able to soon though... I will say that when I'm trying harder to examine what's going on, it "pushes harder" against my good reasoning.
Thanks again, much love.
I never thought there were corners in my mind until I was told to stand in one.
I have learned so much, thanks for keeping it real RRS.
The physical structure of a god brain needs time to rewire. Even years after deconversion I can slip into god-brain if I'm in the right mood.
I think you need to realise that all the values, strengths and beauties appropriated by the world's faiths don't belong to them but to us human beings.
There's absolutely no difference in the goodness of your heart, or the beauty of the world in the instant after you decide to shelve god.
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck
Haha, same thing happened to me after watching one of those Carl Sagan music videos. I had a sudden pantheism surge, and the next day I was wondering what the hell had come over me. lol
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I'm going on the assumption that you're willing to put in some effort to understand and alleviate your guilt, so I'm going to put you onto a couple of lengthy pieces I've written that I think will help.
Please read THIS PIECE on Christian morality. When you're finished, you'll hopefully see that not only are you on the moral high ground without theism, but Christians are actually projecting. Christians are the ones with hopelessly relative morality!
If you're still having problems understanding morality without religion, read THIS PIECE which further explains how morality can be both objective and subjective.
Let's think about this for a second. Suppose I live in Guam and you live in Portugal. Are you doing an injustice to me by not acknowledging my existence? Outside of the obligatory acknowledgement we owe to all people in a philosophical sense, you're not. My life doesn't impact yours, and I have nothing to gain or lose by your acknowledgment. Where acknowledgment is "owed" is where an entreaty has been offered. In other words, you don't owe me acknowledgment until I've given you a reason to do so.
Now, consider that there is no empirical or logical reason to believe that there is a god. But, instead of going the normal route, let's assume the evidence is wrong. There actually is a god. Here's the kicker: God has not given us any reason to acknowledge him because he hasn't given us any reason to believe he exists! For all practical purposes, God is in Guam, hiding out and drinking Pina Coladas. He's not doing anything for you, and there's no reason to think he'd want anything from you. If he wanted something from you, don't you think that because he's all powerful and what-not, he'd be able to ask you for it?
Theists are notorious for projection. As I've written in the articles I linked, it is theists who have no foundation on which to base their morality. By leaving this fatally flawed moral framework, you are actually putting yourself in a position where you can take responsibility for your own actions and use your own brain to work out what is right and what is wrong. Guilt is one of the most effective ways to get someone to do something they don't want. Think of the abusive husband whose wife stays because she thinks it's her fault he gets so mad and beats her. The same thing happens in Christianity. God in the bible is one of the most petulant, vile, and childish figures in all of literature, and yet good people are made to feel guilty for what logically is God's fault. It's a scam.
The Christian God is an atrociously evil character. The number of deaths he's personally responsible for make Hitler and Stalin look like pretty ok fellas. You'd be a lot better off finding a human role model.
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Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin
http://hambydammit.wordpress.com/
Books about atheism
I have pretty recently deconverted, about 9 months ago. Anyways, I'm sure everyone's brain is freaking out and going into logical thinking shock once one admits they no longer believe something they have invested so much of their life into. Keep your mind thinking, it is a good thing. What would be bad is if you simply believed something just because someone told you it was true. Isn't that what we did in the first place when we were theist. My brain shock finally ended and so did my fear of hell and all of that. Thats about all I have to say, peace.
"Take all the heads of the people
and hang them up before the Lord
against the sun.” -- Numbers 25:4
Why would God ever want you to acknowledge him? It's important what person you are and how do you behave to others, not if you tip your hat every time you meet God on the street. If God is worth anything, he will know that. If there is no God, you don't have to worry. And if you just made God angry by not climbing up his ass anymore, then it serves him right!
Rejoice, there is an opportunity ahead of you to show your courage and overcome one of greatest fears, that enslaved whole countries during medieval ages. I believe it will make you stronger and more self- confident.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.
Thanks again guys and to say it again, I really appreciate the support. I still don't know what to reply but just wanted to express my gratitude. There's a lot of good things said here to reply to! It has directly or indirectly helped me dash away the things I described.
I'm now putting a lot of thought into what level I want to take my personal non-believer activism to... Is there a non-believer alliance or anything like that? Or maybe an atheist handbook haha... I'd love to see that.
I'm off to read Hamby's links now. Thanks again guys.
(Oh and by the way Hamby I actually had someone unrelated to this forum link me to your blog the other day, I thought that was pretty cool!)
I never thought there were corners in my mind until I was told to stand in one.
I have learned so much, thanks for keeping it real RRS.
That "feeling of guilt" is a natural residual affect of the prior constant bombardment in your life that belief was a virtue. It has nothing to do with believing a particular label, just that society treats it as a taboo not to be challenged.
To this day I can remember after reading an AP opinion of an atheist nurse after 9/11 wanting to find other atheists. It was the first time that I decided to be unafraid of seeking out like minded people. But because of the deep indoctrination society had inflicted on me since I was a kid, when I clicked on my first atheist website, I litterally thought to myself, "What am I doing? Am I exploring a cult?".
Your "feelings of guilt" are natural, but falsely instilled on you by society. The reality is that you have nothing to feel guilty about. It would be no different than say if a Muslim decided that they no longer believed in Allah would have a hard time in Muslim societies.
Many of us here have had those same feelings, but rest assured, over time, they go away.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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I don't normally jump in just to cheer, but I'll make an exception this time.
<<< closest I could get to a cheerleader
Excellent posts, both Luminon and Brian37!
I thought you guys both brought the topic down to Earth and put it into practical words. It's really a simple idea. Why feel guilty for something you're not doing wrong? It's an artificial guilt instilled by society, and it serves no good purpose.
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So I was lying in bed last night and the thought occurred to me that I'm afraid of there not being a God. It means a lot of things: no afterlife, no divine justice for evil men, stuff like that.
Everyone hit the nail right on the head with their posts so thanks again! Particularly exceptional points that have helped include the emotional inertia, the fear, theist projection, rewiring my brain, and more. Thanks a ton to everyone who posted!
I didn't think of it when I was trying to sleep, but it really hit me today that my confusing feelings were based in fear and guilt as well as a haunting past... But now I realize that I really have nothing to fear or feel bad about. Everyone has to die. Everyone has to deal with injustice (obviously some more than others though.) Etc. These things are either fair or should be fair to every last one of us.
My fear is turning into courage and strength! I'm freer now and that has too many benefits to explain. Ever.
Even if we entertain the notion of there being a God, what has God offered to us in regard to improve ourselves and know the truth of things? Nothing, in fact, it would be less than nothing considering a few things but including how religion has always held back science and ethics. As a matter of fact if God exists, I'd say he appreciates atheists and agnostics for being free above those who do nothing but cause fear and illogic.
I'll hold it to that, "you're not my blog."
Thank you so much for the clarity RRS.
I never thought there were corners in my mind until I was told to stand in one.
I have learned so much, thanks for keeping it real RRS.
So... who wins the toaster on this guy?
I think we should let him keep it...
Maybe we need a de-conversion testimonal drum.
Think of the t-shirts:
"RRS saved me from an eternity in hell!"
"Now I tell god to go fuck himself - thanks RRS!"
Anyway pal - in case it hasn't occured to you yet, you are part of RRS - stop talking all separate-like.
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck
Prove your thanks to RRS. Barbecue a kitten and make a recording, description or account of the NFL without their express written permission.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
I second this motion.
Pal, most of us here are ex-theists. You're at the beginning of a wonderful journey. Some of us have been on the road for a long time. We're still all on the same road.
Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin
http://hambydammit.wordpress.com/
Books about atheism
Thanks guys.
Related:
Ah, MrPal, your posts in this thread are very refreshing.
I think it's important to emphasize that beliefs and desires do not change reality. It might be even more important to notice when we are personally biased for or against a claim simply because it appeals to our emotions. It's hard to honestly evaluate the validity of ideas that we fear, but if we don't, we are putting our comfort before the truth.
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
I am going to frame this and hang it on my wall.
Logic is a systematic method of coming to the wrong conclusion with confidence.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.