I never said that wars would not take place if there was no religion! What I was trying to convey is that there would be less war if there was no religion…809 million people have died in religious wars  See http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatz.htm#RelCon Just in our time think about the World Trade Center [Kill the infidels]..Holy Jihad, etc].  Israel..The Jews will not give up any territory because God gave it to them.

I am not going to get into god not saving babies, free will etc... All that nonsense is for another posting... For now all I will ssay is "what a guy" {god}

 

 

I get to agree with Luminon for once. Religion in the middle east is not the source of the problem. A rich history of bloodshed combined with poverty, inequality, and overpopulation is the reason there's so much trouble there. Remove religion and nothing much would change.

Yes, there would be probably less wars without religion, but I don't think that significantly less. Behind most of so-called religious war there were things like conquest of territories, elimination of uncomfortable leaders, or just loot.
For example, the Jewish territory was not given to them by God this time, but by their rich American brethren in charge of bank system and media. There is no God involved, but USA. USA needed a troubleshooter in middle East, and so there are Jews, doing pretty much what Nazis did to them before. There was already more than 60 OSN resolutions against Israel, but none were carried out, thanks to USA. And profound bias in global media makes sure, that there still are people that sympathize with Israel.
My point is, that (as it's the saying) for wise people religion is false, for foolish people it's true, and for powerful people it's useful. The religion has some good functions for a certain type of people. I believe, that no type of greater religion originally contained emphasis on violence. Not even Islam, which was quite similar to early Christianity, before it got infiltrated by tribal law of Sharia.
Religion surely got terribly overgrown, altered and misinterpreted, and it's in need of a great reforming. Soon, I'm gonna light up a Celtic wreath with 4 candles symbolizing the Southern cross constellation, then I'll kiss a girl under a sacred Celtic herb (mistletoe), get gifts from Greece bishop Nicholas, and welcome the uprising of life-giving Sun back to it's power.

OK.
As for the World Trade Center, I'd rather not go into that as well, because the planes were crashed by religious fanatics, but the buildings were undermined and demolished by someone else. The buildings were built in such a way, that not even several airplanes would bring them down, and not even if they would be all on fire. So I'd attribute the dead in Boeings to religious fanatics, and rest of the dead to someone else.

Yep, in fact, steel loses much of its strength at temperatures well below its melting point,

 

You are referring to the 17 tons of chemical weapons that Iraq admits to having? Or were you speaking of the 17 tons of chemical weapons that Iraq is doing nothing about?

 

Nothing to do with violence in the middle east. Sure there are other factors but the contention between religions and between religious factions is intense.

Sunni and Shiites Islamists murder each other rapaciously and the Arab vs Israeli thing definitely has aspects that sheet home to religion - look at the debate over the

ownership of jerusalem with each side's fairy god father supposedly having granted them the right to the holy city.

I just can't wait for the oil to run out. It will relegate that whole region to the position of irrelevance it so richly deserves.

It's a shame really - given the middle east is the birthplace of civilization. Maybe we should view it as a reality TV lesson on how not to manage the environment and how

not to handle social inequalities.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Unfortunately... You are absolutely correct!!!  AND no one can refute this fact.. They can use smoke & mirrors to explain why so many are killed in  "religious" wars or motivated by "religious feelings"...but not this one for sure!!!!!!

 

In regards to Buddhism I believe, as in all religions, there were great numbers of people who ignored the basic tenet of Buddhism.  "Buddhism is a path of practice and spiritual development leading to Insight into the true nature of life. Buddhist practices such as meditation are means of changing oneself in order to develop the qualities of awareness, kindness, and wisdom" .. Which is more of a self development program rather than a "ture" religion.. You know the "god" thing...  By the way I do not practice Buddhism.  Although I do try to develop the qualities of awareness, kindness, and wisdom.

Well, I am sure the bulk of the people were still basically Buddhist, just like the majority of the people under Stalin were still at heart Orthodox - just look at how quickly Churches were rebuilt and people came back after the overthrow of communism. That impressed me when I was touring Russia, when informed how some Cathedrals that had been torn down or seriously allowed to fall into disrepair had been restored.

Even if they weren't basically religious during those regimes, that still reflects badly on the religion, that such regimes could emerge from an allegedly highly religious population.

Same goes for Cambodia, because it has long been such a very strongly Buddhist society. I have also visited it, and stayed near Angkor Wat.

I can't help thinking that the nature of their belief allowed them to shut out the horrors, with inward contemplation, which was fine for them, but allowed the evil ones to rampage unopposed. I was re-assured that this was not inevitable, when the monks in Burma/Myanmar demonstrated against their government more recently.

True, very true...