Q about Bob Spence
Posted on: April 24, 2010 - 8:40pm
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Q about Bob Spence
Bob's post are so robotic. I mean, you read them and there is no indication that it is an actual person behind the computer typing them. Every one of his posts is written like a 11th grade physics text book.
Does Bob have emotions?
Does he have hobbies?
Does he have a girlfriend?
Kids?
Bob, have you ever cried over the loss of a loved one?
Just give me some indication that you are actually a human being.
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If you'd read the man's posts over a period of time you'd get a solid feel for the thoughtful person behind them. We can't all be as governed by high emotion as you are. I've only been posting here a few months but in that time I've gleaned the answers to most all the questions you've asked here, including those I consider offensive in this context. Why not try paying attention to some one other than yourself for a change?
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck
What is your problem?
Are you that pissed-off that I don't take the nonsense that is your whole world-view any more seriously than a child's belief in Santa Claus, that I treat it as the sad joke that it is?
Friends? What provoked those comments?
I hope you have some real friends beside the imaginary one that lives in the dark recesses of your mind, that you suck up to.
You have just lived down to the worst stereotype of the ignorant, arrogant Theist.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
I will confess to getting deeply depressed and emotional at times, when contemplating just how many apparently intelligent people fall for the evil meme that is Christianity, and the related ones, like Islam, especially when I hear another report of some persecution or atrocity committed in the name of 'God'.
It can take a real effort at times for me to refrain from spelling out in some explicit language the emotional reaction I have when contemplating the blindness and delusion people like yourself want to promulgate, the deep offence to the ideal of truth you commit with every expression of your belief.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
I think I should feel gratified - it seems my approach has 'hit a nerve'.
FS has failed to find an emotional handle to counter-act my rational demolition of his 'arguments'.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
You haven't hit a nerve. I really want to know if you are a real human being, or just some robot.
Do you have a wife and kids?
OK F/S, you are asking if BobSpence is a robot. Past that, you are asking a few specific details.
However, you have only been here for a few days, so how would you even know all that much about him? In all seriousness, how can you tell if any poster on any forum is a robot or not?
I have been here for about a year and a half. In theory, robotBobSpence is half a world away from me so real time chat is unlikely to happen. Even so, I am willing to grant him provisional status as being able to pass the Turing Test. Given that, does it even matter if he happens to be a robot?
Now, let me play with your more specific questions:
Does that matter all that much? Really, one of my bosses is a guy who does not seem to have any emotions. I could say that I know from over 20 years of experience that he is flesh and blood. However, that only matters if you can prove that I am not a robot.
Well, what is the definition of a hobby? Bob has never mentioned anything like, I don't know, basket weaving. He does often mention having traveled to distant parts of the planet, so unless his employer is bankrolling his adventures, world travel might count as a hobby.
Or a boyfriend. He is silent on the matter, which, as a human, would be his right. However, if he is a robot, then that would get into how robots would define sex. When real verifiable robots are all over the place, I am disposed to let them figure that much out for themselves. If they choose to tell the rest of us, then I suppose that that is fine. How whatever they come up with will be relevant to humans, well, I just don't see the point.
I have never seen him mention this. Again, it goes to his private life. If he is a robot, again, that is something that is probably going to be far more meaningful to robots that it is going to be to humans. If robots come up with such a concept then so be it. It is hardly for me to worry about. Unless, of course, I happen to be a robot.
Please see my above comment on emotions. If he is a robot, then I would grant him the possibility that another robot who had a database that meshed with his might have some existence on a hard drive that had a grave mechanical failure. Would robots care about such things? Just for shit and giggles, let's assume that robots do care about that type of thing. Then yah, they will feel bad in whatever way that makes sense.
I submit that you are a racist. Given the possibility that a robot might be a valid mind, then your question comes down to “Is BobSpence a nigger/slope/bohunk/beaner/mic/robot?
=
I'll have to make extra effort to not end up like them, because my score in your list is not very good. (and programming was my hobby for 5 years) I'm here for 2 years and I like it here, precisely for the reason that there are intellectuals around. IRL, I don't know any. There are forums with a plenty of emotions, warm fuzzy huggy smileys and cute pictures...eww. The kind of people that responds to chain letters and sends oversweeted PowerPoint presentations. Really, I have emotions, but they're not the kind that normal people can handle. It's sometimes better without emotions, trust me.
What I don't like about people like Bob is their deadly seriousness. Just because I have no lack of I and Q vitamines, there's no reason to be grumpy. Thanks to psychosomatic feedback of stress hormons, grumpy people will die earlier and more painfully. If you feel fine, use normal humour. If you feel bad, use normal or morbid humour. Just don't be grumpy.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.
To the OP, how rude. What I've noticed is that he stays on topic, which is not an undesirable trait.
Can the mods make him a troll badge?
That is all.
Funny.... I read Bob's posts and I think..."I would like to have a beer with that smart motherfucker"
www.RichWoodsBlog.com
I am genuinely curious as to what provoked this tangent, which is totally irrelevant to his argument.
I still can't help thinking he is expressing his frustration at having zero success in coming up with an argument which I can't easily dismiss.
Why 'robotic'?
It's funny, throwing walls of symbolic logic expressions at us seems far less 'human' to me than arguing in words, which is my preference when discussing such subtle and tricky to define concepts.
He is the one insisting that God can be 'proved' by the process of assigning such inherently 'transcendental' concepts as God and eternity to symbols and mechanically, robotically, manipulating them according to rigid rules to derive the implications of the initial propositions, when all you can ever do by such a process is show whether or not your initial assumptions are mutually consistent or not, and show what those assumptions imply.
He has excessive 'faith' in logic and what it can do, and also in the unquestionable truth of his base assumptions. I guess he can't wrap his mind around a world-view not sharing those same ideas. When you see those concepts as the only possible origin of our mind and 'soul', anyone not perceiving the 'obvious' truth they embody, must not have a 'soul', I guess. Hence the 'robotic' accusation.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
What do you have against robots FS?
Do you fear they will replace you on your job, making you obsolete?
Do you fear they will be given larger, vibrating penises than you and thus able to please women better than you could hope to do, making you totally obsolete?
Aren't you looking forward to the day when science can make a Victoria's secret supermodel equivalent robotic nymphomaniac that does not care about your 'little' problem?
NSFW: True Companion Debuts Sex Robot Roxxxy
Where does this disdain come from?
Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen
Exactly. And just because you can't get an emotional reaction from him doesn't mean he has no emotions. He simply won't resort to that childish level of discussion, and I've seen it multiple times, bob will either stay completely 100% rational/reasonable/respectful or bow out of the conversation if the other people in the discussion are getting to wishy washy and loopy. In long threads I find my eye catching bobs avatar subconciously because I know something with real substance has been said. Just because he wont come way way wwway down to your (and others) emotional mentality doesn't mean he is a robbot. I would go as far as to say bob is one of the smartest mofo's on the site, and in my opigion would be an A class choice to represent "our" cause. I resently opened a thread trying to get to know Eloise another brilliant/somewhat robotic member of the site. I however approached the matter with much more respect, and you should have aswell. These types are not easily drawn into informal conversations.
"Does bob have friends?"
Are you serious??? Buddy pppplease, he's got atleast 20 here. I'm sure bob's rational "robotic" way of discussion doesn't translate into his personal life, just like nayone else.
Do you?
I have occasionally dropped an 'f-bomb', with or without '**', typically as a parting shot, to make clear my total frustration with some poster.
By refraining from it most of the time, I think it makes it more effective as a form of emphasis and expression when I do...
The intermediate stage is typically some variation of 'aarrgghhh!'.
Part of the reason I do refrain is that I actually have tended to have a 'short fuse', way back from childhood. I have learned to consciously hold back, keep my cool, because I know if I 'lose it', I can too easily do or say something I will be sorry for later.
Once or twice I have quickly gone back and deleted or edited a post which had would have destroyed my 'reputation' instantly...
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
Hmmm! See there you go, something I didn't know about him. It's obvious Bob is just another dude, that get's happy and mad just like enyone else. Enough that he would say things in jest, just like anyone else. He seems to be though, just very good at controlling himself. These great discussions need people like bob to be the "emotionless rational responders."
This same guy's over in another thread, complaining about how the atheists here act like a bunch of 12 year olds.
There's just no pleasing this fellow.
What time is it there?
Ah, so -9 hours from my time zone. (CDT)
1:15pm here - Brisbane (AEST = UTC +10).
October - March, our Southern States - not here in Queensland - observe Daylight Saving Time (UTC + 11 for the Eastern states )
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
Hey Bob, I'd like to hijack this thread a bit, since it seems to have begun largely as pointless flamebaiting, and since you're already here:
What happened with Rational_Theist? One day I was arguing with him, the next day every thread he'd posted in was gone. I'm guessing he got banned so hard that everything within ten meters of him got burned, but what happened?
Religion is a virus.
Fight the infection.
I am guessing some mod decided he was worth kicking out completely - I wasn't involved, I was also surprised when suddenly I couldn't find any of the threads he had been in.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
You suppose that only "supercomputer overlords" is the only outcome of a potential Technological Singularity event?
edit; I meant "only" not "one", grrrr
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
He drinks a whisky drink
He drinks a vodka drink
He drinks a lager drink
He drinks a cider drink
He sings the songs that remind him
Of the good times
He sings the songs that remind him
Of the better times:
'Oh Danny Boy
Danny Boy
Danny Boy...'
I get knocked down
But I get up again
So You're never going to keep me down
I get knocked down
But I get up again
And You're never going to keep me down
(Suffice it to say, I'm feeling rather like a jubilant fool atm)
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
No. There are several variants on the Singularity theme. There's the Helios Ending possibility: A self-aware machine enters into a gestalt with an augmented human. There's the Necron possibility: transferal of some or all of human consciousness into machine bodies. The Deep Thought possibility: we design a machine to design a better machine that designs a better machine, etc. Some form of inorganic evolution could be fun; a scenario in which there are multiple Singularities competing for dominance.
You know, Chumbawamba has done some interesting things since the 90s.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUZimSEpZ0U
Religion is a virus.
Fight the infection.
*Ahem*
The OP of this thread IS Rational_Theist. Before that, he was Fortunate Son. Now, he's Fortunate_S.
Either he keeps forgetting his password or he likes to freshen up after every time he gets spanked.
Edit: Oh, did he actually get banned? I didn't see anything that warranted a ban.
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
What, really? Fortunate_S doesn't read anything like R_T.
Religion is a virus.
Fight the infection.
Rational_Theist actually stated in a thread (which is now gone) that he was Fortunate Son.
It seems like the same person to me; even if his username wasn't Fortunate_S, I could probably figure it out. He is still playing semantic games with his modal ontological argument.
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
What's this about "enjoy your time with Kapkao" you said in response to that whacky Krullish??? Hmmm??
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Done and agreed.
And yes, this is the same person. Fortunate Son = rational theist = fortunate s. Yes we have a rule against multiple accounts, but we need a good solid lunatic around here so I've let him stay. If you folks are bothered by him, we'll yank him.
Vote for Democrats to save us all from the anti-American Republican party!
Please become a Patron of Brian Sapient
That's not typical. I don't remember and I don't care enough to spend the 30 minutes on the research. Like I said though, if anyone is overly frustrated by him... he's gone. Just let me know.
Vote for Democrats to save us all from the anti-American Republican party!
Please become a Patron of Brian Sapient
He's gone back to the "Fortunate_Son" name.
"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin
At Least he named himself after a good song...
www.RichWoodsBlog.com
I've seen Bob get pissed before on this forum.
Christ, FS/RT/FS2 you are one weird cookie. That whole thing where you had an entire thread devoted to being a total lunatic blows my mind. I think I'd like to meet you and see what the heck you're really like.
Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.
Apparently you don't seem to think I qualify...
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
http://www.meetup.com/BrisbaneAtheists/members/3951825/
http://fox.uq.net.au/~zzbspenc/index.html
And wow, giving out your personal phone number????
Ok, Matt, you made this same point in one of your earlier 'attacks'....
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
Wow....
I think the troll wants to be put in time out.
Edit: Omg, I've always wanted to go to Italy. What was your general impression of Italy, Bob?
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
Wait, Bob isn't a robot?
Having enjoyed his posts in the past, I now feel somewhat cheated...
Does this mean the Easter Bunny isn't real?
I find it extremely instructive that F_S had so little of note to say that he/she found it necessary to begin a new thread.
Bob- you should feel special!
I do, to an extent. I at least feel I have really 'got to him', scored some real points against his 'arguments'.
That last bit about me having my phone and email address on line fits into exactly the same 'scenario' I encountered from someone a few years ago, who the other mods were pretty sure was Matt Shizzle, who had recently been kicked off the forum. A whole swathe of Theist threads, followed by this sort of 'attack' and insult against one or more prominent members of the forum.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
It was great, pretty much as 'advertised'.
Venice was truly magical. I would love to go back there with my digital SLR. Everywhere I looked I could see 'pictures' - old walls and ironwork, canals, reflections, gondalas, etc, etc.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
I was really surprised by how many crabs there were in the canals- I had never imagined it as part of the ocean before (although I don't know why not). Kind of a shock there- though that's not to say it wasn't beautiful.
One place I really want to go- and it probably sounds silly from your perspective- Australia. Great scuba diving there.
Ever been diving Bob? Amazing- though I've only had the joy of doing it in Mexico.
And from the Brisbane athiest meetup page:
So yah...
=
Actually I have. Was a real passion for a long while. Last dive trip was in 2000 to Vanuatu.
Wouldn't mind doing some more.
I have dived in the Red Sea, Micronesia (Truk Lagoon, Palau), Papua-New Guinea, The Solomon Islands, Fiji, Maldives, not to mention our own Great Barrier Reef, out into the Coral Sea, and various other places around the east and southern coast of Australia. Haven't seen whales, but heard them. Seen more than enough sharks, sea snakes, closer than I was comfortable with.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
I had an up close and personal with a six or so foot long bright green Moray eel once; I know the feeling. While I'm glad it didn't bite my hand off, that would have been interesting.
Curious: If I were to take a trip down under, how much would I be looking at, thereabouts, for a week of diving, preferably somewhere not terribly crowded (I'm O.K. with less plentiful reefs if it's more private)?
I can get by on hostels, but equipment rental I don't know about- I don't own any these days. What's it like off the beaten path?
Oh, jeez, I really hope it's not Matt. I kinda liked Matt, even though he eventually spiraled into a kind of psychotic singularity. While his cat picture rather got old (I would've liked to have seen different cats, with more interesting phrases), he at least had several different notes. Maybe not a full song, but certainly a melody, of sorts. And while I understood the decisions that went into his ban, I hated to see him go.
FS/RA/FS has just a single note, sung at the top of his voice. Not only is it based on a poor understanding of modal logic, but it's boringly repetitious, like a kid banging on a single pot with a wooden spoon. It's a far cry from the kettle drums in Kansas's Magnum Opus. (Not that I listen to Kansas anymore. No, Sir.) In my world, the third-worst character flaw you can have is being boring. (The first is the willingness to fuck over others for your own gain. The second is being willfully ignorant.)
All I can say is, Matt rarely bored me. FS/RA/FS bores the fuck out of me, and is willfully ignorant. If he turns out to be Matt, I'll be very disappointed.
"Yes, I seriously believe that consciousness is a product of a natural process. I find that the neuroscientists, psychologists, and philosophers who proceed from that premise are the ones who are actually making useful contributions to our understanding of the mind." - PZ Myers
Would it really shock anyone if this was Matt? I mean at this point Fortunate son is nothing more than a blithering idiot, all of his posts just more or less come out saying the same thing, basically, you don't understand you don't know and your stupid, after that it just goes more into personal attacks on the person, but never address really the problems with his posts the other people point out really, i mean he tries but then just breaks down to personal attacks, even this attack on Bob it's just his lack of ability to argue his points across intelligently enough to make logical sense.
You got it backwards, holmes! See... I'm Matt Shitzle. That other guy was just a lame imitation!
(... at least until May 1st, then it's back to being boring ol Kapkao)
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I think I have been irritating to Bob a few times. I would consider the fact that he doesn't seem to childishly attempt to demean people for not sharing his views, or at least without good cause a redeeming feature, not robotic. I myself childishly demean people, but usually only after they have made an ass of themselves, at least to me =).
Bob said he gets depressed when intelligent people fall for religion, or something similair. I get depressed that there are just so many stupid people who are too lazy and caught up in their own little box to think for themselves. God is the easy out, and with this fiction it frees them up to pursue that new big screen tv or x-box or whatever status symbol they can come up with. They don't realize it is not "god" giving them these things, but the labor of a thinking mind somewhere. I see so many of them every single day, yea it's depressing when I think about it.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Wait. Wait. Wait.
Luminon, you're saying that you personally know two people who are human bodies that have been hijacked by alien intelligences?
Jesus fucking Christ. How do you still have any money to pay for an internet connection with?
- Leon Trotsky, Last Will & Testament
February 27, 1940