Atheist Bigotry:Are Atheist Bigots,for generalizing about Religious Theists ?
Posted on: June 14, 2010 - 8:59pm
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Atheist Bigotry:Are Atheist Bigots,for generalizing about Religious Theists ?
I was reading this post about Atheism and came upon this, http://atheism.about.com/od/fundamentalistatheist/a/AtheistBigots.htm?ni=1
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Did you mean this article?
http://atheism.about.com/od/fundamentalistatheists/a/AtheistBigots.htm
I kinda see what he's saying, but I vehemently disagree with his handwaving dismissal of generlisations of Theists by atheists.
No, first of all those generalizations, feed the Theists generalizations,. Second of all, seeing as one of the main critisims [and a valid one] against theism is that it isn't empirically correct, and seeing as we want people to make empirically correct statements, I think there's a conflict here.
I think you're an Aspie, but that's just a gut instinct I've cultivated recently.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Yes indeed,and thank you very much for your expertise.
I don't really care about "bigotry". To me "bigotry" means "I've offended someone's delicate sensibilities out there".
But I think it might be valid to point out that everyone finds "Evangelical Atheists" (aka "Dawkins' Witnesses" ) annoying as HELL!
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
aka I HATE CLICKING ON "POST REPLY" TWICE!
I don't know what "Long in the tooth" means in this case, but "Aspie" is the accepted term for 'someone with Asperger's syndrome'. (It's actually called "Asperger's disorder in America, but same difference)
"Aspies" tend to be atheists. Bar none, almost.
People with Asperger's syndrome tend to be human-esque versions of.... well, Spock... basically. (Gross oversimplification, but nevertheless...)
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I happen to enjoy Dawkins matter of factly I don't give a shit what you think attitude, when he speaks an angel dies somewhere in the world.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Generalizations about some category of people would only be 'bigotry' if they insisted that it applied to everyone in the group, which rarely applies with human beliefs and attitudes.
Statements about the validity or otherwise of the actual beliefs of a group would be hard to categorize as 'bigotry'.
Religious belief is almost by definition not empirically justified, and usually has gaping flaws in logic, but not necessarily. The major flaws are the unjustified assumptions which are simply asserted to be true, 'based on' 'spiritual' experiences and such. They may well apply logic to 'deducing' the doctrine following from those assumptions or core beliefs, but don't have any way to justify the starting points themselves, and usually assume they are self-evident, or undeniable, etc.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
"WHO CARES?"
Logic and theism aren't compatible today... so what? Don't assume that is going to be a universal constant - After-all, Immanuel Kant himself was Lutheran; he considered Christianity to be both Natural and Rational. Obviuosly, religion took a different form in the 18th century, then it does today. Imagine Christianity suddenly re-assuming the same form it had in the 18th century...
Activistic atheism would suddenly go on civilization's back-burner!
Mark my words on this.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I'm almost positive that RRS-cofounder "Rook Hawkins"/Tom Verenna has High Functioning Autism in addition to Asperger's. I wouldn't be surprised if he has a "professional Dx" (Diagnosis) as well.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
I happen to find "Dawkins' Witness" a stupid, atheistic pseudocult. Stop borrowing someone else's words, fellow atheists!
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
But... DAMMIT... Dawkins is evil! EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!
He put the lid on his own website! It doesn't get more shameless than that.
The thing that people forget while surfing the internet sometimes is that when on a messageboard, you're still guests in somebody else's house- don't make yourself unwelcome!
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Calling Bigots, Bigots...is not being a bigot...
If we, as a group publically began deriding Nazi's... No one would call us bigots... The truth is, Compared to Nazi's... religion has a much richer history of Murder, Rape, Torture, unbridaled hatred, masogeny..not to mention kid touching...
Sorry... I make no apologioes about speaking the truth regarding Bigotry disguised as morality...
www.RichWoodsBlog.com
Who Cares?
I do, and many others here.
If you, Kapkao, don't, then OK, that's your position.
And don't bother throwing at me the ideas of other people who may have acquired some fame or notoriety as 'philosophers', what they said is still basically just their opinion.
I regard Kant as marginally more worth listening to than most philosophers, but not all that much.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
Oh but I will... that's what RRS is for.
RRS'ers aren't accustomed to having their positions challenged? Odd.
Actually... I do. But then....
Apparently, you don't like to be challenged about your beliefs. You can't really prove God doesn't exist.
Natural told a lie at atheistnexus: RRS isn't anywhere near "unapologetic".
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Oh, np with you throwing Kant's ideas at me, just don't expect me to be impressed, is all I meant.
How did you get that conclusion?
We do care about the stupid ideas, the illogic and irrationality of Xtians, that is fundamental to RRS.
<EDIT>
Yes, we do disagree with people who disagree with us, we don't like their ideas. That doesn't automatically mean we don't like being "challenged".
It is responding to those challenges that is fundamental to the site, so I don't quite see the point of your observation.
</EDIT>
Again, how did you get to the conclusion that I don't like to be challenged, from my position that I just don't find the reasoning of Kant and many other famous philosophers very convincing, and as ultimately being no better than an expression of their personal opinion?
Are you making an "argument from authority", that Kant deserves more respect than I give him?
And WTF has the 'fact' that we can't prove that God doesn't exist got to do with anything? We can't prove an infinite number of far more plausible things aren't actually true, either. You have to have a way of filtering out just which un-disproveable ideas may still be worth considering, and we choose to base ours on plausiblity, consistency, and how much they actually match current demonstrated theories, rather than how long a tradition may be attached to them.
So why should we take seriously an idea that has no evidence for it, and raises a whole bunch of unnecessary complications in trying to insert it into our modern understanding of "Life , the Universe, and Everything" ?
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
I seem to be a bigot in so many other ways, whats one more added to the list ? Opinions now are construed as bigotry. If you don't like something that seems politically fashionable, you too can be a bigot. Call 1-800-bigots-r-us and get your free pamphlet and starter kit today! Be one of the next 20 callers and receive a free issue of "Global Bigots"!
Because surely the religious are not bigots when it comes to atheism.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
From my childhood, I have considered theism as a completely unjustified universally bad nonsense based on various twisted fairy tales.
However, I would certainly 'hesitate' to point out to a theist that he is a dumb idiot (who he of course is) on every occasion.
For this, I would NOT classify myself as an anti-theist. There are many different atheists, and saying that all we are anti-theists etc. is a bigotry itself. So, I agree with you that generalizations feed generalizations (self-amplified generalization).
That said, my little Christmas wish is to bring all Christians, Muslims, etc. in one place (say, Jerusalem) and let them discuss their little theological problem. I really wish the Christian prophesy is fulfilled in the part that on one happy day god will cleanse the Earth face of ALL the believers.
... yesterday, I watched "Waiting for Armageddon" followed by "Atomic Cafe". These apparently different documentaries have so many in common!
I don't have the answer for any of that- I'm just being a (seemingly!) useless devil's advocate.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Kapkao, didn't you realize that atheism is NOT a religion. Atheists are FREE to do whatever they are doing. And psychiatric diseases exist no matter what your beliefs or disbeliefs are.
I find FSM is an interesting educational precedent. It would be cool too to see the Church of F***ing Magnets that brings us new knowledge of how various F***ing things work through deep spiritual experience. So, I like to make some fun of religion when appropriate.
Probably, atheists can be divided into two polar categories: 1) zen-atheists, who do not care about religion AT ALL and 2) atheists-crusaders, who are ready to act to wipe all religions from the face of the Earth.
(I am somewhere between these two)
"Dawkins' Witnesses" is just normal phenomenon, that just is. If you don't like it, it is you.
Oh wait, we are talking about me enjoying someones attitude. I didn't think it was worthy of a real response. /yawn
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
It is not contradictory for atheists to be 'evangelical'.
It is simply a matter of politics and lobbying.
After all, the religious are masters in that field and atheism has a lot of catching up to do.
If the religious stopped trying to influence politics, it would be more reasonable to consider the promotion of atheism OTT.
I'm going to remember this next time someone calls me "suka"
(Yes. "It is me"............................. LMFAO)
Asperger's isn't a psychiatric disease, unless it causes someone who has it is someone a dysfunctional individual because of it. It's not "a disease", imho.
But then... maybe I'm jealous of Allison because I don't have $3000 available in order to have myself screened. (I don't consider myself to be "Neurotypical" by any stretch of the imagination... so the best I can hope to call myself is "extremely introverted" aka schizoid.)
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)
Kapkao, don't you realize that atheism is NOT a religion?
Ah... so if I want to start faith-healing others while not giving much of a shit about "Christ", that's ok, yes?
translation=Atheists have a right to their ideals as well as expressing such ideals. (But maybe they should try being a little more original?)
(or whatever it was you were trying to say... I'm not 100% sure myself)
Who said anything about "Disease"? Oh... that's right... you did.
Translation=While there is probably a correlation between autism and atheism, it really "holds no water" in the long run. (Aspies are "probably" the missing link between Homo Sapiens Sapiens and Homo Superior, anyhow
)
I've never been anti-pasta myself, but I still think pastafarianism is stupid.
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HUH?
Al Swearengen thinks you're a cunt, btw.
trans:I like to poke fun at irrational theisms when I can get away with it.
Most likely
There are two general types of atheists: casuals and "crusaders"
'Casuals' don't give a rat's ass about "God".
and then there's these "Crusader" types who want to expel "god" from the minds of everyone.
A "Dawkins' Witness" is just a variant on the "Crusader" archetype. If you don't care for it, that's your choice!
And remember everyone-
In Soviet Russia, language speaks you.
“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)