Catholics advocate possession?
Posted on: December 9, 2010 - 11:37am
Offline
Catholics advocate possession?
Firstly I am not a theist but I do like to know how theists think.
In the book 'interview with an exorcist' I am stunned to find this:
73. Why does God allow demonic possessions to occur?
While this is ultimately a mystery, we can see that God allows possession for the following reasons:
• Possession demonstrates the truth of the Catholic faith.
• Possession punishes sinners who seek a relationship with evil.
• Possession can be a spiritual benefit.
• Possession can produce wholesome teachings for humanity.
The third one is horrifying? Benefit?!!!
Someone explain this please
- Login to post comments
Personally, I think they're all horrifying, not to mention disgusting.
Explanation ? They don't need one as long as people believe this crap. And there is no excuse for still believing in "demonic possession". None whatsoever.
Here's my take. Numbers 2 and 3 are probably based on the passage where the Apostle Paul is writing to the Church in Corinth about immorality: This passage can be found in 1 Corinthians 5:1-5, and I quote it here from the NASB:
"1 It is actually reported that there is immorality among you, and immorality of such a kind as does not exist even among the Gentiles, that someone has his father's wife. 2 You have become arrogant and have not mourned instead, so that the one who had done this deed would be removed from your midst. 3 For I, on my part, though absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged him who has so committed this, as though I were present. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus, when you are assembled, and I with you in spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus."
For punishment as described for those in unbelief, destined for the final judgment.
For spiritual benefit, that all is not lost with that individual, and in so doing could result in salvation.
Catholic doctrine claims for itself truth and anyone not aligning is anathema (Vatican II).
As far as the fourth bullet, yes, if the Christian considers that fate exists, the reminder of such can be used to strengthen faith through teaching and what might be considered a 'threat.'
Clear as mud?
Greater love has no man than this, that he lay down his life for a friend.
More examples of the twisted 'reasoning' resorted to to defend the indefensible.
If it 'proves' God, it proves he is an evil prick.
Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality
"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris
The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me
From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology
..................According to the church: YOU MUST BELIEVE!!!!! If you do NOT believe that demons can possess; then you are an anti-christ who thinks that Satan is more powerful then God even when Satan is more powerful then GOD!!!!!!!!!!!
................ Possession proves the catholic faith because Satan waves his middle finger at GOD and that is THAT!!!!!!!!!!!
................Sinners who have relationship with evil get possessed because they have the frequaint users benifits program, The platinum program makes it even quicker.
............... The spiritual benifit of sinning is that it is one hell of a better way to understanding of life then any boring church could deliver has in "...deliver us from evil, but take your time; we should realy get to know evil before we dis it completely
............... Only a church could proclaim "SIN" teaches wholesome humanity.
Personally I prefur to ignor all churches and their teachings. I sleep better at night.
.
"Very funny Scotty; now beam down our clothes."
VEGETARIAN: Ancient Hindu word for "lousy hunter"
If man was formed from dirt, why is there still dirt?
Thanks for the replies so far. It does seem truly insane that the catholic writer cites advantages for such occurrences. Would welcome more theist thoughts on the matter
Have you read http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12315a.htm ?
Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.
I am way more curious as to who is this Devil actually according to the NT ?
Near as I can tell. In the OT we see "Mr. Big Shorts" wee tike providing a minimal role as resident Adversary. But we find a all grown up version of ha-Satan in the New Testament. Honestly not sure: the Chief Devil is an allusive thing, especially in identifying of it. In the New Testament He said many things and did many things yada yada. I am calling to your mind the bible account of encountering the Devil in the Wilderness (according to the bible) and one other passage. I am one who expects something better. Perhaps you will see it's not easy to figure out. Alert, I have purposely striked out the unhighlighted bits in my quotes. No one have a cow.
6 and 'he' said to Him, “If You are the Son of God
throw Yourself downFor it is written: He shall give His angels charge over you,and,In their hands they shall bear you up, Lest you dash your foot against a stone.’” 7 Jesus said to him, “It is written again, ‘You shall not tempt the LORD your God.’8
Again,the Devil took Himup on an exceedingly high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory.9 And he said to Him, “All these things I will give You if You will fall down and worship me.”42 Jesus said
to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word.Fore You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him.When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me?This gives us an idea of the Devil's Modus operandi but gives us an incomplete picture of its' identity. And do not say it is the snake in the book of Genesis.
Well, right now I am trying to have a folk song about infanticide ready for open mike night tomorrow. If I am possessed then it is by a very uncreative demon. And one who clearly cannot consult with other demons on this...
=
You have a book by or regardking an exorcist. The claims made are premised upon the fact of possession. The fact is supposedly evidenced by the observations and experiences of at least this one person and presumably thousands of others through the last two millenia.
Now here are us atheists who get our jollies off laughing at the entire god thing. And now we look for a wholesome teaching for humanity.
Would not wholesome mean evidence there is a god? While it would not be direct evidence, possession would at least open an entirely new field of evidence to scientific investigate the matter. There are dozens of suppliers of very affordable surveillance systems. For well under $1000 you can get four cameras, a multiplexer, and direct to DVD recording with IR LEDs for use in the dark. Is there any excuse for failing to record evidence of possession? And after recording to make it public to bring the world to salvation in Jesus Christ or whomever?
One would expect images that would make Hollywood possession movies pale in comparison. Split pea soup should be the minimum production value for a self-respecting demon. Where are the videos?
Floating in the air? Things flying through the air? Ancient languages? No problem. It is all captured for review by experts. And there should be dozens of records like this if possession is as common as believers claim. Where are the videos?
There is certainly a market for them. Consider the crap syfy puts out these days. This can't be worse. And the costs wold be editting and narration. All the special effects would be free. What is more impressive? A wrestler throwing a man through the air or a 12 year old girl doing the same? I'm for the kid.
So here they are sitting on the potential to establish the supernatural as real and they do nothing.
Is not the most obvious explanatoin they know it is bullshit and don't want the world to know they know it?
Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.
www.ussliberty.org
www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html
www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml