Suporting my son not going to church.
Offline My eldest son (15) wanted to have a talk to me as he felt his mother would not understand how he was feeling (both being adventists he knew as an aethist I would be more considerate of his views). His problem was that at the church they go to, he was starting to get annoyed with the internal bickering that was going on (that made me chuckle), and did not want to go every week. Part of the problem was he was getting tired of the pastor/priest (whatever you call them) telling everyone what the could and could not do on the sabbath (I prefer the word "Saturday" ), and that they could not be married to non adventists.
He then reminded me that I said ages ago that I would back him up should his mother or the church start to push him into something he was not happy with doing. This jogged my memory on a discussion I had with my wife years ago about dragging the kids to church and trying to force her beliefs on them. Taking that memory on board I told my son that he is now at an age where he can make up his own mind on what he wants to in regards going to church or not and that when he reaches 16, should he decide that he has had enough with the whole religion crap that I would have no issues with backing him up regardless of what his mother or the church say.
Now I'm not saying I stood up and gave a long winded speech about the stupidity of religion, just that if he wanted to stand up for himself and needed somebody to be there for him then he could count on me for support.
I know this is going to cause a lot of friction between me and my wife, however I flatly refuse (and I have told her many a time) that at the point that any of our children decide they no longer wish to be part of her religion that I will not stand by and have them be bullied or coerced into something they no longer wish to be a part of and being unhappy.
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Tough issues.
I think you are on the right track. Support your son on what ever decision he decides.
Be prepared for the worst.
I think you are doing the right thing. Those who try to force the unwilling to do or believe something always end up with the short end of the stick.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Nice notion, but no, in reality sometimes the tyrant, bully and criminal win and can go through their entire life not understanding the pain they cause others. The good thing, despite that reality, is that they also don't always win.
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Guns, Brian the answer is always more guns.
As always you are wrong. The bully might win a great number of battles, but they ALWAYS die in the end.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Gotrek, I would take it a step further. Be willing to have open discussions about religion. If possible a family discussion. Make sure to utilize socratic method and avoid coming on too strong. If your wife doesn't want part of those discussions, fuel your son with knowledge from your perspective. In my opinion, the best thing you can do is open up about why you feel the way you do. Give him an at home atheist church so to speak... a learning center. He's been bombarded with the theist angle, can you help balance that injustice with some reality from your perspective?
Oh, and if the wife has a problem with you teaching your son reality, it's a divorceable offense in my eyes. disclaimer: I'm not married, never have been, probably never will be... but I do "crush" a lot.
There are two times in my life that I was assaulted by a friend without provocation or warning. I believe both people to have been mentally unstable. The trauma I have felt from those events are with me almost daily. I am completely unaware of the current state of life of both people. As far as I'm concerned they could both already be dead... it wouldn't change the fact that I will live with the trauma of those events for the rest of my life. Sure, I'll die... but the pain caused by the bully can outlive the bully.
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That's true, but it doesn't have any bearing on the fact that a bully can't win forever. The more vicious and brutal someone in power is, the faster does resistance to their imposed authority rise, until one day it crumbles away.
I spent most of my years in school being bullied in various ways by various people. Some of it was psychological and some of it was very physical. It had a deep effect on me that will never go away. And as a direct result of those assholes and bitches I won't stand for it anymore. The last time someone I couldn't handle fucked with me, I put him in jail. Every bully to screw with me since that one I either beat the fuck out of or scared them off with pure vicious rage.
They'll never step on me again. I'll kill them first.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.