My mom died March 1rst.
Offline Haven't been on much for the past couple weeks since her diagnosis. Docs at the time did give her the option to do something, but said it would be a 50/50 proposition and she turned it down because she simply didn't want any more surguries, she has been through a lot prior. The selfish part of me was screaming in my head wanting her to try, but I also understood why she chose not to.
It is hell watching such wonderful person slowly decline and go. But even in that she is so brave every day she made every effort to smile and let me know she loves me. I have been a wreck since the diagnosis and now but today have been more calm becuase I was able to do something for my mom's memorial.
Mom is also the reason I have all the current knowledge in my head. Her support is why I met my best friend Bob and John from Oklahoma. Mom is why I was able to read authors like Hitchens and Dawkins and Harris. My mom is why I have my current cat Sarah, best cat ever. Mom is everything to me.
Mom is also why I have written poetry for 20 years and ended up being able to have this site as my poetry thread home. All the education over time helped shape those poems. Brian Sapient thank you for this home and I know my mom is very happy that I have this home to even vent and argue.
Everyone hold those dear to you as much as you can and never fail to tell them you love them.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
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my sincere condolences. take care of yourself.
My deepest sympathies.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Thanks. Doesn't matter whom you are, when you are close to family it hurts. Mom is so giving and thoughtful. Today marks a week since, and tonight mom should be calling me to remind me that Full Frontal is on. She'll do the same thing with Redskins games, and even did so with the COSMOS series. She'll call me 2 3 times a day many times simply to tell me she loves me. Thoughtful with everyone she knows too.
And as with my debates everywhere mom loves hearing what I argue and what the other side says. She is well aware of the history here too. She spent a season on another atheist website as a guest NFL pick, no betting, just pick winners or losers, just to have something fun to do with me.
Extremely thoughtful even of people she never met. I got mad on another website over an atheist slamming hispanics as to which I have living on both sides of me, always nice, never a lick of trouble. So a couple of months ago one of my neighbors was having a BBQ and I joked "can I have some", not really wanting it just being silly. So a couple hours later I get a knock on my door and they had brought me a plate of food. I told my mom, and her first response "You need to do something for them". I bought them a 6 pack, but turned out they don't drink.
30 years of teaching, 1000s of kids in that time, Ohio State Grad. So well loved mom and I drove from NC to Alabama a few years aback because one of her students asked her to attend his wedding. Everyone at her independent living home and even at the nursing home loves her. Mom impacted countless lives.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
My condolences.
"Nobody wants to be told about the countless minor horrors and humiliations that become facts of “life” when your body turns from being a friend to being a foe: the boring switch from chronic constipation to its sudden dramatic opposite; the equally nasty double cross of feeling acute hunger while fearing even the scent of food; the absolute misery of gut–wringing nausea on an utterly empty stomach; or the pathetic discovery that hair loss extends to the disappearance of the follicles in your nostrils, and thus to the childish and irritating phenomenon of a permanently runny nose. Sorry, but you did ask... It’s no fun to appreciate to the full the truth of the materialist proposition that I don’t have a body, I am a body. But it’s not really possible to adopt a stance of “Don’t ask, don’t tell,” either. Like its original, this is a prescription for hypocrisy and double standards. Friends and relatives, obviously, don’t really have the option of not making kind inquiries. One way of trying to put them at their ease is to be as candid as possible and not to adopt any sort of euphemism or denial. The swiftest way of doing this is to note that the thing about Stage Four is that there is no such thing as Stage Five. Quite rightly, some take me up on it. I recently had to accept that I wasn’t going to be able to attend my niece’s wedding, in my old hometown and former university in Oxford. This depressed me for more than one reason, and an especially close friend inquired, “Is it that you’re afraid you’ll never see England again?” As it happens he was exactly right to ask, and it had been precisely that which had been bothering me, but I was unreasonably shocked by his bluntness. I’ll do the facing of hard facts, thanks. Don’t you be doing it too. And yet I had absolutely invited the question. Telling someone else, with deliberate realism, that once I’d had a few more scans and treatments I might be told by the doctors that things from now on could be mainly a matter of “management,” I again had the wind knocked out of me when she said, “Yes, I suppose a time comes when you have to consider letting go.” How true, and how crisp a summary of what I had just said myself. But again there was the unreasonable urge to have a kind of monopoly on, or a sort of veto over, what was actually sayable. Cancer victimhood contains a permanent temptation to be self–centered and even solipsistic.” ― Christopher Hitchens, Mortality
Thanks for that post Digital, mom simply got tired of it all. I cant blame her. I am still in denial, in the context of being so close, but not in any rational sense. Bodies wear out. That day about 2 hours before the nurse Taylor told me it wouldn't be much longer. I didn't want to process it even though I heard it and understood it, just screamed in my head not wanting it to happen. Mom would appreciate you posting this for me. She stuck around for me the prior night. I had to leave for the night because she had a roommate. I kept telling her over and over that I had to leave but would stay for Wheel Of Fortune because she likes it. It pulled her just enough out of her meds to smile and nod when I left, kept repeating "I'll see you in the morning".
Definately brave on mom's part after getting the diagnosis. The only comfort I can find now is that she is no longer in pain, and helping with her memorial. I used to be angry at mom during my teens for sending me away when my dad died. I now completely understand it having to watch her decline and go. Death is ugly no mater how. Facing your mortality on top of the physical pain has to the hardest but most brave decision anyone can make. For the observers of loved ones going throught it, there is no solace in sugar coating it, at least not for me. No old book of myth or promise of a cosmic security guard can replace my mom, or her life of giving and caring, tangible and real.
My solice is in her life, the real time we have. My solice is also in that as Krauss put it, that we are even here because of the atoms an exploding star long ago provided that atoms that lead to our solar system, earth and evolution and eventually my mom. Her subsequent teaching and adoption of me, and a lifetime of time spent with mom. The first christmas I can remember after my adoption mom got me a giant Whinnie The Poo, kept that till I was 17 or 18 till it was completely warn out. Took me all over the states as a kid, even to Europe. Always there for me never let me down even as an adult. Grew very close since I moved down here. Was able to relax her parental "boys don't cry, or goof in pulbic" she tried to instill on me. She allows me to be silly so much more now and gets silly with me just to say, "I love you". I enjoy all the simple time we spent together, just going to the dollar store, watching Redskins games or Ohio State games. Love watching her in the rear view while sing along with ABBA while sitting in the back of the van going anywhere. All that and more. Tangable and real, taken away by harsh reality. But mom will always be with me in my thoughts and memory and everyone who met her and loves her.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Our bodies are exactly how they are supposed to be, every atom, every molecule. They are in motion before we are born, they will be in motion long after we are gone, until the Universe either dissipates or collapses on itself. Death waits for us to arrive. In essence, we are all dead and born at the same moment. We pass through the experiences. As Hitchens said, "I don't have a body, I am a body". To which I say, "We don't watch time pass, we pass through time".
Your experience is similar to mine with my grandmother. I went to her the night before I left for China. I was leaving for three weeks. I went to her, even though the had her all drugged up, held her hand, told her every thing on my mind. I told her all the things she did that I would miss and told her that I was sorry for all the things I did out of anger were low points in my life. When I was away she passed, but my mom told me her last words were asking for me; where was I?
I believe that is why I had the experience I had when I was in China. She was searching for me. I had been her eyes and ears, her legs, her hands for many years. She had gone blind and she had lost her sense of balance, she had broken several bones from falls. I had become a part of her.
When she passed, I had a "dream" and it was only her hands. I never saw her face. The hands which I had always looked at with a mysterious curiosity. I saw all the blemishes and warts, the knotty knuckles; I thought about all the wars she had see and the rape and the beatings, the babies she held, the hands she shook and the tears she had wiped. They were hands with nine decades of toil.
That's why I believe in a life after death, but not in the way 99% of the world believes. I believe our physical world and our existence in it is a manifestation of our desire to feel, to fulfill to seek an existence of substance. Our emotions betray us because they are a symptom of those desires and the loss or gain of what we desire. With out our body, we are an energy, a pattern.
I know it sounds kooky, but while I reject all gods, all religions, I know there is more to experience that just this Universe. Through all its fabulous experiences, it is still an existence of suffering, until we learn to control our reaction to the results of the physical world we have no control over.
So sorry to hear of your loss Brian, take care. It will be better. As you indicate she helped form you to be the person you are so you will always have the memories.
PJTS
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"I guess it's time to ask if you live under high voltage power transmission lines which have been shown to cause stimulation of the fantasy centers of the brain due to electromagnetic waves?" - Me
"God is omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent, - it says so right here on the label. If you have a mind capable of believing all three of these divine attributes simultaneously, I have a wonderful bargain for you. No checks please. Cash and in small bills." - Robert A Heinlein.
Posted by this one . . danatemporary
Hey! I know your mom was one of your closest relationships, I am so sorry Bri.
Hey! I know your mom was one of your closest relationships, I am so very sorry Bri.
http://omo.io/image/7QA
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A Photograph, Watch And Urn, By Brian37
March 13
Amost 2 weeks out
Surreal, not true
I don't want it to be
Picture this
A photograph of Reagan's erra
Mom and I
Her infectious smile
Old photograph
Of happiness
Never fades
In my mind
The watch on my wrist
Once her christmas gift
I look down at now
With bittersweet stare
I cant look at too long
I cant look away
Either way
The void brings me pain
And all I have left
Is an urn
I want her smile
I want her laugh
I want the life
In that photograph
I want the smile
When I gave her the watch
But all I have left
Is the urn
It cannot call me
On the phone
To tell me she loves me
Or take her to shop
Her ashes cant
Laugh at my bad jokes
I gently touch the watch
But it does not respond
Like my mom
Full of life, is what I want
Almost two weeks out
It's still surreal
A photograph, a watch
All that's left is an urn
I talk to the photographs
Just the same
The don't respond
I desperately want them to
I talk to the urn
Neither does it
All that is left
Are mom's ashes
You cant have mom
Do you hear me time?
Do you understand
I know you don't care about my pain!
I have that photograph
I wear this watch
And although you left me
With an urn
DAMN YOU TIME
I have her still
All you did
Was take nature's toll
I am still here
Mom is still with me
No not in the urn
I carry more that that
Mom is in me
Mom is in my friends
Mom is all the positive
Things she has done
She is in
That photograph
She is the reason
I gave her that watch
I hate this surreal
Urn that is left
I want that life
In the watch and photographs
No even trade
No thank you time
I want her
Not this urn you perscribed
Almost two weeks out
Quit reminding me time
That you wait for no one
Not even my mom
One more year
One more month
One more day
One more hour
One more hour
Please time please
Even one more minute
Please time please
Please time please
Anything, anything
Anthing time, anything
Besides this urn you left me with
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
These ruminations about the inevitability of death are completely wrong. They sound like they come from religious people rather than rational responders that know about science.
The mechanisms that cause cellular aging are well understood and the technology to reprogram how cells work is rapidly advancing and well funded. These 'never' predictions are like the "man will never fly" preditions in the 1800s.
Before you tell me how wrong I am, please tell me what disease science can never cure and why? Sure death may be likely for us due to accidents, war, poverty, etc... Highly likely is different than inevitable.
Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen
This is not the thread for your bullshit si fi woo, got it. But ok fine, you brought it up.
LIFE can only be extended there is no such thing as immortality and there never will be. PERIOD. Even if we get to the point of replicating our thoughts to computers, that is still a delay and even then, our thoughts resign on a computer even then would not be us, our brain which would not be forever it would just be a computer simulation of us. This planet and our sun will die and all life on it and even the universe will have an end. There is no forever, just a delay. Can we extend that delay? Yes, but there is no forever. You fucking show me where the hell I claimed we cant cure things. Stem cell research is valuable and will lead to cures, and yes we can extend lifespans, but there will never be a forever, not for life not for this planet not for our sun not for the universe.
This thread is about my mom. Not sure how you talking about possible cures or extending the average lifespan will bring my mom back, it will not.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
i'm sure you meant to put a "sorry for your loss" in there somewhere. it just slipped your tiny little mind.
"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson
Please have some respect EXC. There's absolutely no reason to step on Brian when you are capable of starting another topic to vent your opinions.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Thanks for the kind words Vastet and Ibwiek and Didgital . Everyone has someone they are close to in their lives. Reading your comments now is bittersweet because I cannot call her to tell her what you have posted, which I miss tremendously.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
we have plenty of differences, which we have vocalized ferociously in the past and probably will again, but that doesn't mean i feel you shouldn't be treated with basic human decency.
"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson
Brian, sorry for the loss of your mother. You seemed to have had a really good relationship with her, which isn't always the case between parents and their offspring. There have been plenty of times where I've deliberately been snarky with you ( just to get a rise out of you ) but this is not one of those times. I hope your grief doesn't linger.
Thanks, I really don't hate anyone to say the point of wanting them arrested or dead. I too fight others not just here but on many pages. It is very universal when it comes to those you are close to, especially if you are close to family, to feel pain when you lose them.
Many of my friends since she died are saying the same thing. It hurts but you do have to move on, not forget, but for your mental health. Being able to help with her memorial has helped. I am also having one of my friends John, whom Bob Spence is friends with visit me in June to help spread mom's ashes. That also gives me something to look forward to. I have known both Bob and John since 01 and it hurts that they never got to meet my mom.
I do feel extremly lucky to have my mom. If you have even one family member and a couple of friends in your life, whom accept you for who you are and love you no matter what, you have everything. I have that with my mom. I cant say this enough, tell your close loved ones and friends you love them frequently.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
hear, hear.
"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson
Truly sorry to hear of your loss Brian, I can tell through the years of fond words from you that the two of you were exceptionally close. The closer you are to someone the harder it is when they pass, but in the end the fond memories you have make it worth it. Best wishes.
If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X
Thanks Beyond. My mom and I are very close. And yes, for anyone that close it is hard. There are moments in life where empathy is understood and pain is understood. It is hard for anyone, not just me. It is hard on her friends too. But she did convey her concern after her decisiion how I would make out after. I am doing better now that I have worked on her memorial, and have had lots of people to talk to on line and on the phone since. That is something everyone should do to cope.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Sorry to hear about your mom, Brian--that sucks. I always enjoyed reading about the relationship you had with her.
Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.