You're making a lot of assumptions - that the story of the crucifiction is true, Jesus really existed, he really was God/the son of God, etc. Many people are able to cry at sad movies, songs,Stories etc even when they know for a fact it is fiction.

Do you deny that people of all religions and of no religion can be emotionally overwhelmed by certain things? If not, I fail to see your point.

I'm curious why you felt a need to post that when you know everyone here (excluding perhaps, the various theists) is probably going to roll their eyes. 

Actually, it could have been the music. Google "music and emotions" and you'll get a ton of sites that deal with this very topic.  Music does affect our emotions.  Why do you think movies have musical sound tracks?

Music also has the power to break down inhibitions.  (Google that, too.)  I don't know how many sermons I sat through as a Christian (Baptist, Foursquare, non-denominational, etc.) that ended with closed eyes and the congregation singing "Just as I Am."  Music can be manipulative.

That said, I'm studying music formally, hoping to eventually add a music major to my degree.  I'd like to study up a bit on how music affects us.  It sounds like a fascinating topic.

Sugarfree, it is obvious that you did have an emotional experience and that is fine. Let me turn the tables. Would you cry if your child were murdered or would you be thrilled since that child is now in heaven (assuming he/she believed) and is with jesus? Without assuming too much my guess is that you would miss your child terribly and reconcile with god once your anger and grief passed. An atheist would do the same thing except reconcile with god. We would move on with our lives the same as you would. The actions are the same, you simply keep adding an extra step.

 

I do not mean to be disrespectful, but your thread seems ridiculous to me. Many things move people to tears. Child abuse, animal abuse, murder, rape, genocide, extreme ignorance...all of these things move me to tears as do songs related to them.

Simply, I am repulsed by the arrogance of those people that think Jesus's sufferings were special in some way.

I cried at the end of Terminator 2.

I'm not surprised that it sounds ridiculous to you.

I guess what I am wondering, tho, is, in your life, do you have anything that makes you feel so small and humble, yet at the same time, so important and special? My tears weren't grief tears necessarily...which would be the types of tears shed for those things you mentioned above. Or maybe they were grief tears, but mixed with a profound thankfulness. Because, when considering what Christ did on the cross, it really isn't possible to separate the two. So maybe I should ask, what are atheist profoundly thankful for, that moves them to tears?

Yes. The universe makes me feel small and my insignificant knowledge of it makes me feel humble. The fact that I am alive and part of it makes me feel important and special.

Well, if you don't know, I can't help you. I cried when both of my children were born for both reasons. Thankful that they were both healthy and grief because I realized just how precious life is.

Only to you.

As stated in my post and others in this thread, many, many things. 

Yeah, I have to admit this confuses me. I can see only two motives and they aren't necessarily exclusive: 1) to make us poor atheists realize how inferior and without hope we are if we don't believe in Jesus and 2) justify the theistic position and the Christian persecution complex:

Matthew 10:22 "And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved."

Either way the post reeks of arrogance couched in faux humility, which is the very bedrock of the Christian mindset.  Maybe I'm overreacting, but it almost seems like flame-bait.

I guess what I am wondering, tho, is, in your life, do you have anything that makes you feel so small and humble, yet at the same time, so important and special?

Actually yes there is. I am humbled by my tiny, seemingly insignificant place in the span of the cosmos, stretching for billions of light years, and being nothing more than a drop among infinite parallel universes like it (no longer science fiction in theoretical physics). But I feel special as a being who, as of yet, is one of the most complex and beautiful objects that is known to exist. 

What moves atheists to tears?

A swift kick in the nuts usually does the trick

Sugar, I suppose you just haven't believed me when I've told you this before, but most of us have been where you are. I know what it's like to be in one of those church services. I've been in them. Oh, and Iruka, I used to play piano for them, and I was really good at getting people to cry. One day maybe we can talk about that. I promise you're on the right track. The pastor never had any idea how much power I had as the musician! (Of course, in those days, I gave credit to god. In retrospect, I realize it was me.)

Sugar, I'll tell you something else that you'll probably just gloss over and ignore because it doesn't agree with your world model. Atheists are generally extremely thoughtful, caring, giving, and empathetic people. Why? Because we know that life really is precious! Every atheist I know has a reputation of being an exceptionally warm-hearted person.

Remember that movie, Big Fish, about a guy's father dying? I bawled like a baby at that. I lost my father about 10 years ago. (Before you get on your high horse and decide that's why I left god, don't. I was an atheist well before that.) The guy in that movie got to say goodbye to his dad, and I didn't, so I cried.

When I was done crying, I left the theater, had a great discussion with my girlfriend about what a great guy my dad was, and then we went to dinner.

We're people, too, sugar.

You can get off your high horse any time you like, and try to imagine that maybe everyone else on the planet feels emotions just like you do, regardless of which sky-fairie they do or don't believe in.

 

 I personally am aware that if I accepted Jesus's love, I would recieve it and feel his love just like you do. But the interesting thing is that if you really believe that The Flying Spaghetti Monster wants to save you and give you its love if you accept it, and you do, you will feel the same way you feel now thinking that you're connected to Jesus and that he's giving you his love. It's all in our heads. The difference between you and us is probably that your brain has been pre-programmed by religious dogma so when you "feel this love", you immediately attribute it to Jesus. On the other hand, we, the athests, are aware that our brain can produce strong feelings of love, joy, happiness without a deity, so we don't immediately acribe this love and emotion that brings us to tears - to immaginary friends that our grandparents are talking about.

Also let me point out that you don't ever really see or experience Jesus directly, instead you DECIDE "Wow, this has to be Jesus". Be honest and admit it.

 So now, to help you understand us...

We don't accept Jesus in our hearts for the SAME REASON you don't accept The Flying Spaghetti Monster in your heart - we see that it's all a silly story, and can easily live and die without it.

Cheers. 

The Time Traveler's Wife, by Audrey Niffenegger.

 (I'm a guy, I swear!  Stop snickering!!!!)

Yes. It's ridiculous. The average person suffers more in their lives than any 'jesus' could. Christians who assert that 'jesus suffered' or that 'jesus sacrificed' clearly aren't bothering to think their claims through.

 A child with leukemia suffers more, everyday, without any reason.

I issue my challenge for any theist:

It makes no sense to state that something is a sacrifice when 1) there was no loss, and 2) the gain for the behavior was infinite.

Jesus could not suffer even as much as a normal person:

Here is why:

1) He knows he's not really going to die in the first place

Here's a purported prophecy of the crucifixion.....
Quote:

Mark 8:34 (New International Version)

34Then he called the crowd to him along with his disciples and said: "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.

(By the way, this passage is self refuting... Jesus didn't 'take up the cross" until after this "event". So what meaning could his reference have for the audience he was speaking to?!)

2) He knows that he will be loved and adored for his act
3) He knows he will save billions of souls with his act.
4) He knows his reward is infinitity in bliss.
5) He knows he will not lose anything, ergo, no sacrifice.

This is not a 'sacrifice' therefore, at all. In fact, its the biggest, best deal in the world, and I challenge a theist to respond as to whether they would go on the cross. I've never seen a theist dare respond at all.

So why do theists call this a 'sacrifice'? Because they don't bother to think it through. It takes compartmentalization. You have to forget that millions die every day in doubt, for no reason. That's the real pain in the world. A child dies of starvation, with no reason, no reward, nothing.

A cancer patient watches his body whither away, in pain. He's not getting any reward, any recognition, no assurance that he will go to some heaven. He just faces death without any comfort.

How many people in the world have sacrificed real blood for others? A mother or a father dies to save their own child - no reward, no assurances. They just do it.

Every day, every person suffers more pain than this supposed savior could ever have suffered "for us". We all live in doubt, we all suffer pains. We do it because we must. Some of us even give more - we sacrifice our time, our blood, even our lives, for others.

No rewards. No guarentees.

A solidier gives up his life for his country. What reward does he get? A ribbon nailed to a wall somewhere, his name recorded in an unseen history book.

Think about it like this: imagine your child is about to be burned alive forever. And someone says to you: you can save him if you agree to go on the cross for three hours. In return, you not only save your own child, you save all children in the world. In addition, you are remembered and loved by billions. Oh, and one more thing: you go directly to heaven, in eternal bliss (after a three day tour of hell, all expenses paid!)

Would you refuse? Would ANYONE refuse? Seriously. There can be no greater gift in the world than to be offered the opportunity.

Again, I challenge a theist to answer the question: Would you go on the cross?

Watch as they continually dodge the question...

 

Susan, you are simply wrong in your assessment of my motivation.  If you understood my motivation, you may also understand what I am trying to say to you.

It's not about "getting" people to cry.  Sometimes, that just happens.  It is not the goal, and if it is, the motivations are not in the right place.

Sugar, either you intentionally misrepresented my post (lied) or didn't read the rest of it.

Please go back and re-read it, and either apologize for lying about what I said, or admit that you didn't bother to read it carefully.

 

{Edit: 1000th post}

 

 

I concur.  And if you do decide to use your mind to investigate religion objectively, it will be one of the hardest things you've ever done. When I learned I'd wasted a good chunk of my life on a lie, it pissed me off.  I'm still pissed off, mainly because so many others are being manipulated into an unhealthy god-belief.  I especially feel for the poor kids.

I can also say that Christianity fostered some pretty negative things in me: arrogance hidden by false humility; hatred of homosexuals; a sense of righteousness that was unwarranted; unquestioning submission to authority figures...the list goes on. At least my current set of faults are mine and not inculcated by dogma.  

I do not understand why people equate the relationship of life and infinite with that of numbers of infinity.

Would you give up a child to gain a million children? Would it be any easier of a choice if you gained three million? or any easier of a choice if you only gain 4?

Human minds attached significance to things (sometimes) whether or not they are proportionally insignificant.  Such things are concepts of "life" in general.

So.. To say that Jesus sacrificed nothing is mixing the inside-out observation with the outside-in and saying it's impossible.

From from a purely inside-out way of looking at things.. Jesus had, at one time, everything.  Yet gave it up (a proportionally significant amount) so that man could understand him.

Yet.. I believe.. in the theistic belief.. it is likened to this. (And I believe I have used this before with CoF).

"Bill Gates gives up everything he has to live as a black female child caught up in the slave trade of ole.  And while he knows he will get it all back in 3 days.. he will get ONLY what he originally had in the first place."

Now.. times that by infinity and take it to the depths of forever and you will barely have a glimpse of what I am talking about.--Joe Black.

This is a lie.  And if not a lie.. then not perceptive.. and if perceptive and not a lie.. then not long term memory... and if none of those.. then something else that I can not think of at the moment (like I am mistaken.. hah-- which in essence makes the entire previous statement void. Beh.. I can't help but qualify my statements.. for some reason I just don't like committing to absolutes as absolutes.).

Something.. but I definitely "dared" to respond.

I DO NOT mean to belittle the belittle the sacrifices that people make everyday.. but.. I think they are fallacious comparison.

How do you compare finite man giving finite things for an infinite God giving up infinite things+1.. even if temporarily.

I don't think they can be compared.

Anycase.. I don't think I should jump into another conversation.  For the most part.. I do agree that the post seems a bit odd.  What do atheist shed tears over? I would imagine a lot of the same things that theist do.

We are a visceral people.  (I hope I used the word correctly.

So... your personal emotions regarding a mythological story are somehow suppose to advocate its relevance to reality?

While the story is sad - it isn't unique. Jesus' crucifixion doesn't bring me to tears anymore than the crucifixion of his preceeding messiahs (i.e. Mithras, Horus, Prometheus, Attis). These messiahs were also sacraficially crucified for the redemption of mankind.

I understand that you are a Christian - and treat Christ as if he is special in this respect - however - I see all the Messiahs. There isn't justifiable cause to treat him as anything more than the others. I find the story of Horus' crucifixion to be much more moving and tear-jerking. Christ's sacrafice pales in comparison. Likewise - the sacrafice of Mithras draws much stronger emotions. Christ's story is truely mundane - comparatively.

Don't get me wrong - Christ's story is genuinly sad and tragic. However, when compared to preceeding messiah myths - it lacks the depth and profound emotional backing - leaving much to be desired from this particular myth.

???

Now this kind of sensless drivel drives me to tears. Way to sidestep... I mean, you really do need that mental god crutch of yours so much that you are willing to commit very cartwheels of intellectual dishonesty in order to smooth away the ructions in your mind created by this question?

What did jesus give up? He went to heaven and fulfilled his predestined task. Where is the giving up attached to this? You state he had 'everything' - what the hell is that supposed to mean? Eh? Are you serious? Please don't try to base an argument on a one-word assertion that you totally fail to subsequently quantify. You cannot have anything useful if you are following your predestined path. Because being able to use something, to take advantage of something, you need the free will to do so. So what is this "everything" he had? Please quantify what "having everything" means, in non-etherial terms.

How do men understand him then? Like Mr. Dawkins says - how can you understand a man sent to die on the cross for the sins of the (already widely accepted) allegorical figure of Adam? Doesn't sound very understandable to me. I'm sure your response would be something suitably mysterious, and I'm really looking forward to it.

The original question - what makes me cry? Well I'm fairly practical and I don't cry a lot. But looking at BBC footage of rows of tents of living skeletons dying in hopelessness and squalor of a nasty but preventable disease because they weren't allowed to use the one thing that would save them - that gets me as close as anything.

And don't go on about that abstinence rubbish - it won't work so it's not an option.

Hamby, I did read your entire post, and that particular sentence stood out among all the rest.  If you did not mean it to sound the way it did, I apologize, otherwise, my comment stands. 

Sugar:

I used to be very angry. I am no more. However, I can understand alot of people's frustration here.

Yes, people could have said some things more gingerly, but do you take away a msg? It's to challenge yourself. Think for yourself. Check out some of those sites i recommended. Always be open to understanding that which you do not understand.