Oh, really how did they 'take the roll of god and become it'? I am genuinely curious about this claim. Not to mention the fact that you deity apparently is unwilling, despite all the prayers offered to it, to give people sufficient food except through human agents. IE your deity is apparently either incompetent, lazy, or simply nonexistent

Hi OP

I will help you regarding why Jesus walked on water and why we can't.

the term miracle is not found in the Bible since it was established as an old english 9th century term. The term miracle is a kind of empty ambiguous term.

The term used for miracles is signs and wonders.

Thus according to the Scripture in I Corinthains 1:22:

Thus Jesus Christ was demonstrating His Messianic Sovereignty for the purposes of demonstration of His Deity (Logically, the one that creates everything can by default control everything) and for His chosen 12 to write about what happen for the purpose of wonder to those who have been given faith by Christ (Galtians 2:16). Another reason was because the Canon had yet to be completed thus this was part of the apostles wonder.

This is where I differ from most typical Chrisitans. Miracles are a buzz word, everything is now a miracle. A baby's birth, Somebody being rescued spiritually from hell, if it rains when there is drought.

Since Canon is completed MIRACLES NO LONGER HAPPEN TODAY. lol. Let me quality this.

by miracle, I talking about the purpose of a sign and wonder for demonstration via the Jewish people. Signs and miracles don't happen anymore.

Now, technically speaking, while God can still heal, intervene, but not in the sense of the technical understanding of what a miracle use to entail.

As of now, we simply refer to it as God's grace and Sovereigy.

Logically speaking, since "miracles" are no longer existent today, then logically you cannot walk on water.

Respectfully,

Jean Chauvin (Jude 3).

First, as an atheist, I took Socrates' advice to "Follow the evidence wherever it leads". I decided to look at the evidence from both science and Scripture fully expecting to vindicate my atheistic orientation.

In addition I happily accepted the advice of the apostle Paul to "Test everything; hold on to that which is good" (1 Thess. 5:21). This, too, would likely support my atheist faith.

The end result was similar to what Antony Flew experienced; a gradual transition from atheism to theism.

The vehicles from science that supported a theistic worldview were the theological implications of the big bang; the information content of DNA; the complexity of life; the fine-tuning of the universe; the fact that we are self-aware; the failings of Darwinism (i.e. the trilobite is highly complex yet serves as an index fossil for the Cambrian period); the historical accuracy of the bible based on higher criticism, the recognition of "right" and "wrong", and an "old-earth" perspective to name a few.

What I discovered is that there is a mountain of misinformation on both sides of this issue. My assumption at the onset was that if God created the universe and set the laws of physics in place that would make him the author of science, and if God inspired the bible that would make him the author of scripture.

Therefore if science and scripture both have the same author they should not contradict each other. However when I did find contradictions further investigation revealed either bad science, bad theology, or both. And there is a great deal of "both". Presuppositions seem to be at the heart of the conflict.

And now, how would you answer the question, "Why do you not believe?"

Rick

Problem with this argument though is that at least in the old testament the God of the bible and the Torah had no problem performing Miracle-Offs with other deities in the area. The implications that I got looking at it seemed to be something closer to them believing that the other gods did in fact exist, just that they were weaker than their own God. Looking at the Torah it would seem to be more of a kind of trade "Ok, we agree to worship you, and you alone, in exchange you protect us and answer us EACH TIME we call on you, fair, fair."

Not to mention that if there really is a devil and they really wanted to fuck with things, why not pick someone, make them think that they were the chosen on of say...Prometheus. Have them able to conjure fire with a snap of their fingers, bring scientific insights and creations with a gesture and be able to be submitted to the toughest tests to the point where James Randi would be writing the guy a mountain of checks. For a lot of people, these things would go a long way to prove something, but instead the argument seems to be 'well, we don't DO miracles anymore. Even though proving the abilities wouldn't be horribly difficult, apparently God just doesn't want to or care enough to.'

No, that's true. According to the Christian doctrine God created man kind for the purpose of worshiping him. In the bible it basically says to abandon your family, your worldly possessions, all your personal needs and focus all your thoughts on God.
What most Christians think "Heaven" is with streets paved in gold where you will live in paradise forever is completely wrong.

That concept was one of the many things added to Christianity to make it more appealing to the masses. The ACTUAL text says you will be rewarded with a place in heaven where you will sing praises to God for all eternity.
Eternal slavery was a hard sell so they edited the story a little.
 

That sort of thing has an unknown as to how it can be done---the only viable answer is-it takes a certain presence of mind,or mentality, to override physical laws. IF JC had that particular ability it was/is because of his mind set. Today we are of a different mental state that won't allow such things. I have no idea how it works but if it does it takes a different mental attitude. Maybe along with a mind that is at peace and tranquility it becomes possible. We'll be finding out for sure at some future time.

In Luke 23:-40-43,  jesus says to the "good" thief, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

This implies the following sequence of events between Good Friday and Pentecost:

1. Jesus died
2. Jesus went to heaven (presumably without his physical body, and with the Good Thief in tow) before the day was over
   • According to some versions of christianity, jesus descended into hell to liberate the souls that had been suffering, but were now absolved by his death
3. Jesus returned < 3 days later to earth (presumably the sealed tomb, which he then exited)
4. Jesus returned 40 days later to heaven -- with his physical body

Do you as a christian accept this chronology -- and that it makes sense at all?

What about the accuracy of the bible? I'm sure that there is irrefutable to the earth being much older than 6,000-7,000 years old. And if the bible is inaccurate where do we know to begin. John Allegro has done extensive studies on the Dead Sea Scrolls (original bible) and has found it to be filled with the use of hallucinogens. This would explain the mythical stories of a talking snake, a parted ocean, a burning bush, a great flood that killed everyone except Noah and his family, Jesus walking on water, some guy killing an army with a skull of a goat, origins of languages, and so on. To me, thinking rationally, I can assume that these things probably didn't happen. And if they did, there would be no way to prove any of them. Therefore it is harder for me to believe them.

Not saying that I either want to believe or disbelieve these claims, it's just much harder to know in an age of intelligence. Much love though, a never stop thinking about the wonder of our existence. No matter what you believe.