Racial differences?
Offline Since this is a very politically incorrect thing to bring up!
Do you think there is any biological difference between the races? Or are you sure there is not?
Physically?
Emotionally?
Intellectually?
I often wonder this. I think it is irrational to assume all races are exactly the same since we have diverged for a very long period of time. There are some obvious differences...skin color...eye color. Some are debatable...it seems obvious that black guys are, on average, faster than white guys in America...is that true? Is there a reason for it? Does that carry over to Africans and Europeans?
So you know my stance, I am sure I will thought of as racist for even bringing this up...I am 100% not racist. I don't think any race is logically better than any other race. But I do think there are differences and it bothers me when people just act like there isnt.
"When the missionaries arrived, the Africans had the Land and the Missionaries had the Bible, They taught us how to pray with our eyes closed. When we opened them, they had the Land and we had the Bible." - Jomo Kenyatta
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There does seem to be a standard for black basketball players. A job for which the Japanese tend to be shunned. Beyond that, I don't see much of a difference between different ethnicities beyond culture.
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Biological differences? Outside of some (possible) resistances and suceptabilities to particular diseases, and obviously differing tolerances towards the sun due to skin colour, I'd say no.
A word on the athletics issue: It's almost wholly cultural there, too. As an example, one should notice that, in general, african americans dominate basketball. African americans are descended directly from western Africa, which is where the Atlantic Slave Trade stole its property from. Now, if it were the west african black genetic structure that gave these American blacks their skill, or at least an advantage over whites, we can logically assume that the more "pure" west Africans would be better than the blacks in the Americas, most of whom have a white person in their ancestry somewhere. If this were true, logically we'd see every Summer Olympics have countries like Nigeria, Cameroon, Cote'd'Ivore, Sierra Leone, Ghana, etc. dominating basketball, and countries like the U.S.A. only succeeding against them by fluke. This is not the case, however. They don't have basketball courts in every neighbourhood in those countries, whereas most black people in the U.S. are within walking distance of a basketball court. Also, a lot of blacks have it drilled into their heads that without sports, they'll never get into college. Couple that with the huge salaries of the pro sports stars, and you will have kids whose future depends on sports, and who will work harder than the typical recreational athlete. On the flip side, most African nations are rebuilding, and therefore most see sport as recreation only, not something you can or should be professional at given the circumstances. Thus, black americans dominate particular sports due to culture. And it is like that with all things that one group seems to dominate more than others.
Canadians are another example. We love our hockey. We dominate hockey on an international level. Most of us are descended from British or French people. I'd say that French Canadians are more talented than English Canadians, Gretzky notwithstanding. So it should stand to reason that the French and British would be major threats to Canadian dominance of hockey...but they seem to prefer sports like soccer and rugby to hockey. Thus, we whallop most countries in hockey consistently.
One last example of racial differences being purely cultural is in academics. East Asians, Indians and Jews seem to always outscore every other race. However, each of these cultures places more emphasis on learning than African, European, pacific island and American cultures seem to. In the case of the Indians and Jews, it's at least partially due to religion (Hinduism encourages debate amongst other faiths, which is refreshing for someone immersed in interdenominational christian and muslim bickering; Jewish literacy has always been high because of their need to read their scriptures) and in east Asia, it is due largely to their public school systems and the strictness of them. It's not racial superiority here, simply differing emphases in differing cultures.
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This was an interesting read..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/olympics2000/olympics_talk/913148.stm
"A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven." -- former Canadian Prime Minister Jean Chretien
I hope a biologist will chime in later, but I've heard the difference between "races" is negligible genetically.
Anyone who views you as racist for asking this is clearly ignorant. While each person is capable of achieving the same goals there are clearly racial differences. Anyone who denies the differences between ethnic groups is either an overzealous apologist or retarded. The problem is when we're not able to celebrate our differences and learn to laugh at ourselves.
On the sports topic, I don't believe for a minute that one ethnicity has a genetic trait for a sport and another is deficient. I think it all ties into culture more than race. If you travel to the inner city which normally has a majority black population the main sport you will see being played is basketball. If you go to more rural areas you'll generally see more football. In colder areas you'll see hockey. If you take the average black man who grows up in the inner city and he competes against someone from, let's say, Zimbabwe in basketball the inner city man will generally win. If a white Canadian man were to play a game of hockey with someone such as myself from Mississippi, the Canadian would win.
To say that there are differences between races is not being racist, it's being factual. It's when someone says that because of someone's race they're not capable of doing something is when it becomes racist.
So what do the racial differences mean, then?
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Just take a look. White people generally have thinner noses, thinner hair, smaller lips. Black people have more coarse hair, flatter noses, bigger lips. Asian people... well honestly I only pay attention to the women when it comes to them.
So it's all physical, and simply appearance? Cool. We agree.
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My degree is in Bioinformatics (Genetics). We can see no genetic difference between the races. The problem is even was we wouldnt know what that meant...
We can't take the DNA of someone and say if they have a bad temper, if they score better on spacial tests, how fast they can run a 40.
So to me saying we cant tell the differences genetically doenst mean they are not there.
As far as sports go. You cant compare USA with Camroon because of population...even if Camroon loved Basketball and were biologically supirior to black Americans. USA would prob still have the better team based on numbers alone....unless you were argueing the biological difference is so vast there is not overlap, and I doubt anyone would say that.
I think there is a great deal of overlap...what I am asking is are some races better off at the starting point than others at certain tasks?
If you took 100 Black babies, 100 White Babies, 100 Asian babies...ect. and raised them to be track runners, Engineers, artists would there be a non random result?
THe Strong Man competition seems geared toward northern Europeans. Sure Blacks, French and all sorts of people do well but 80% of them seem to be Scandinavian. Do you think the enviroment they evolved in at all selected for people who could do that?
A broad barrel-chested man would not be much use hunting in the African Savanah 50,000 years ago, just like a Tall skinny man would not be a good match for high altitute and cold weather.
Something were selected for through evolution, do those selections have any modern day implications that are not solely based on apperance.
I think they have to be. I think where it gets sticky is trying to say why they are or if someone is better than another based on it.
Just a random last thought...interracial babies have the lowest incident of genetic deseases because there is less chance of getting the selected against gene from the mother and the father...so actually it could be argued that interracial are better off in that than either race alone. So...go ahead everyoen have some hot interracial sex tonight....tell them I said it was ok not to pull out.
"When the missionaries arrived, the Africans had the Land and the Missionaries had the Bible, They taught us how to pray with our eyes closed. When we opened them, they had the Land and we had the Bible." - Jomo Kenyatta
True, but it might mean they don't matter if they do exist. Much like god.
Bollocks. Why does Canada dominate countries with lots of hockey and more numbers (like the U.S.A. and Russia, both of which have between 5 and 10 times the population of Canada)? The fact is that numbers don't matter that much.
Well, northern europeans have a tradition of strongman that is not found elsewhere. However, I've seen native americans who did fairly well.
I think that your hypothetical test would result in random results.
I agree! I'm interracial, and fine!
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"True, but it might mean they don't matter if they do exist. Much like god."
What is "they" genetic differences?
"Bollocks. Why does Canada dominate countries with lots of hockey and more numbers (like the U.S.A. and Russia, both of which have between 5 and 10 times the population of Canada)? The fact is that numbers don't matter that much. "
Well most of USA isnt made for Icehockey. and as for Russia I think they do well, didnt USA and Russia play for gold in the Olympics in the 80s?
The truth is hockey is a sport that is equipment dependent...Sports like soccer are not so they are a better gauge...Basketball is about as close as you can get to a sport that needs little equipment.
"Well, northern europeans have a tradition of strongman that is not found elsewhere. However, I've seen native americans who did fairly well."
Yes but you have to agree their build is made for putting muscle on. Ill take a Icelandic baby you take a kenyan baby lets see who can create a better powerlifter.
"I think that your hypothetical test would result in random results. "
I dont think the results would be random. I dare not venture to say what I think the results would be, for one I have a biased veiw of races. And I would have no proof to back up what the findings would be.
Give me a Kenyan baby Ill give you a Icelandic baby lets see who can create a better marathon runner.
I agree! I'm interracial, and fine!
Well I think everyone is at least partially interracial...but congrats on that
"When the missionaries arrived, the Africans had the Land and the Missionaries had the Bible, They taught us how to pray with our eyes closed. When we opened them, they had the Land and we had the Bible." - Jomo Kenyatta