I have a great deal of respect for you
Offline Allthough I am Catholic, I have a great deal of respect for you, in your dealing with Kirk Cameron and his boss! These 2 idiots make anyone with faith seem like idiots. I really can't believe that they went on national TV confident that they had proof of the existance of God because a painting of the Mona Lisa had a creator, so then we have a creator. It completely baffeled me, and made me ill that there are some who would consider these 2 idiots to be some kind of "official" when it comes to the existance of God. People of my faith have criticized me for supporting you, and my response has been that you were reacting to a threat by the 2 morons, Kirk Cameron and his boss. I doubt you really care, but Even though I have faith in a higher power, I really respect you for making those 2 zealots look so so stupid right on national TV.
Joe Moe
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I hope this doesnt offend you, but your name is awesome. I wish I had your name.
Allthough I am Catholic, I have a great deal of respect for you, in your dealing with Kirk Cameron and his boss! These 2 idiots make anyone with faith seem like idiots
Yes. Even those two concede that there are much better apologists than either of them. One is a washed-up actor, the other is a preacher whose inadvertant comedy is so priceless there is a a fully-fledged online parody of him called landoverbaptist. They are a pair of clowns.
I doubt you really care, but Even though I have faith in a higher power, I really respect you for making those 2 zealots look so so stupid right on national TV.
Of course we care. We are glad for such feedback. Thanks for taking the time to write this.
"Physical reality” isn’t some arbitrary demarcation. It is defined in terms of what we can systematically investigate, directly or not, by means of our senses. It is preposterous to assert that the process of systematic scientific reasoning arbitrarily excludes “non-physical explanations” because the very notion of “non-physical explanation” is contradictory.
-Me
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What I think hurt them the most besides breaking their own conditions only 8 minutes in were the "Transitional Species" pictures. This was a serious debate and they dipped to a tactic that I wouldn't even expect out of Hamm or Hovind.
Sapient, I believe you said it best, "Damn, what a numbnut."
The Regular Expressions of Humanistic Jones: Where one software Engineer will show the world that God is nothing more than an undefined pointer.
I respect everything you posted, and can appreciate the honesty you presented. We may disagree on beliefs but clearly not on the character of a person.
Thanks for being so honest!
This is the reason why rational people get upset at the ridiculousness of people like Kirk and Ray. The problem transcends these two however, people like them (and there are plenty) have taken over our judicial system, our congress and white house....talk about scary.
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And we have a great deal of respect for you for coming onto a militant atheist board and voicing your kind opinions.
http://atheismisrational.blogspot.com/
Welcome Modmed99.
Thank you for your thoughts.
We're glad you're here. Really!
Everyone is welcome on this site to discuss and debate their beliefs and sometimes throw in a little humor.
I hope you hang around and join in the discussions.
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You have no idea how at ease these responses have made me, I was a lil uneasy about coming here, but I thought you should know that everyone with faith is not like those 2 morons and their followers. I believe strongly in not pushing what I believe strongly about onto anyone else, lol! When I see a has been actor, and the guy riding his coatails who think they need to tell everyone what they should believe in it makes me sick. I had Catholicism shoved down my throat as a child, I was forced through the sacraments, and then forced to go to church untill my Mother could no longer control what I did with my own time. I then thought it was terrible, and the way it was presented, it was! Now as an adult, I have chosen to have some faith, it is a place I go to when things are bad, it gives me a little comfort, and in some ways lets you think there is something to look forward to. Having said that, If I ever was to demand that someone else believe what I believe, under penalty of eternal damnation, then what kind of comfortable place is that? Step out of line and you are going to HELL!! It is a thing that creates animosity. Belief and faith are ones own, and whether you believe what I believe, you believe in something different, or you don't have a belief in a higher power at all, you are %100 entitled to that belief, and no washed up actor, or no named preacher before he met his washed up actor should be trying to make you feel bad about yourself!!!
I really appreciate the forum, those 2 pissed me off so badly, I just had to say something to someone!
Joe Moe!!
I don't think that it was so much... them not being intelligent. They came to the debate with preconceived notions of what they were debating. They didn't even bother to truly do any research or look into any facts or evidence to support their claims. Like Kirk trying to disprove evolution, he didn't have the first clue as to how evolution worked, he came to the debate with the most common misperceptions of it. They are capable of a much better debate, if they stayed to their conditions and actually did some research.
"Why would God send his only son to die an agonizing death to redeem an insignificant bit of carbon?"-Victor J. Stenger.
Thank you very much for being honest. That is really all we ask here, just be an honest debater. If we can talk through things and disagree on some, that is fine, we just really can't stand dishonest prostyltizers.
Well, I do agree that those two are an embarrasment... and they are easy prey too. In my view there is nothing so stupid as trying to prove God's existence in scientific terms. Religious faith does not pursue scientific truth, but a different kind of knowledge.
As some great philosoper put it, "God exists" and "God does not exist" are both absurd propositions.
Welcome! It is always good to hear from rationalist - theist or no. I think many people feel the way you do about the debate. Cameron/Comfort made a ridiculous claim and ended up embarrassing themselves. I hope you stick around and participate in some of the discussions. As Larry said, people like those two are now making laws for the rest of us and it is really scary!!
I think we all should be terrified that people like those two have influence in government and law making. When you see someone who is so blind to any idea other than their own, how can we trust that they will make laws that benefit the general public?
The will obviously make laws that benefit them and theirs, and anyone who disagrees are left in the cold to fend for themselves. The separation of church and state does not only apply to prayer in schools, and someone should really look into exactly what is influencing the people who are suppose to represent all of the people. When the southern congressman who starts every public speech he makes with,"I believe in God." makes his statements, and makes decisions that put laws into effect, and make decisions whether or not to send our soldiers off to a war halfway around the world, Do you feel well represented by him? I guess I have never thought of something like that being a problem, but I guess it really, really is!
Larry is absolutely right, this is very scary to me now, and I guess it should be to everyone, no matter what you believe. When someone makes the kind of decisions that I mentioned earlier, they should in no way be based on any kind of faith. These serious decisions that affect us all should be made with a sound mind, with all of the facts, and with the desire of all of the people in mind, not what God fearing people would like to happen.
As I have said before, I have faith in the trinity of God, I am Roman Catholic, and I want the politicians that represent me not to give one bit of a shit about that fact! I wonder now how different things would be if these political douchebags actually made decisions with respect to the separation of church and state, and I wonder how many decisions were made with religion in mind.
I hope I wasn't too redundant in my ramblings today, but I am tired!! LOL
Joe Moe!
Joe Moe, you remind me of my Catholic family. And they have made my atheism so easy, they've respected it as my choice. My family and I agree with you 100%.
I wish the 2008 elections will be about education, the economy, and foreign relations. But it will be about gay marriage, abortion, and prohibiting stem cell research. It's sad.
I think more people like you and I need to speak up so we could loosen the stranglehold of Christianity on the United States.
YOU shut the fuck up! WE'LL save America!
I understand what you mean with the Catholic church, their hipocracy has tried my patience many many times. Their stand on birth control is irresponsable and unrealistic. Their stand on premarital sex is unrealistic and idealistic. Most of all I have a problem with their stand on stem cell research. When I first heard about the research they made it sound like they were purposly causing abortions to harvest the cells, we now know that that isn't true. Scientists are developing ways to cure absolutely everything using these stem cells, and I don't understand how anyone can have a problem with that. To be able to mend a broken spinal cord, or grow someone a new liver or kidney from scratch is not something that should be obstructed. I have problems with the fact that the Catholic church is one of the richest organizations in the whole world, and every Sunday at churches all over the world they are crying poverty and asking people who don't have much to donate what they do have in the name of God.
There are plenty of problems with the human run church. I don't go to church very often, and some of these problems are why. None of these things though have caused me to do away with my faith in God. I have looked up in trying times, and have gotten some solice from the time spent in prayer or meditation, or whatever you want to call it. To each his own, I believe in that as well. This conversation started because of 2 idiots who believe that you guys are doing something wrong by not believing in God, and that is as ridiculous as their claim that they can prove something about God!
All in all there are alot of problems, and the Catholic church has pelnty, maybe alot more than others, but whether or not the church is run well, or what idiotic policies they try to enforce through scare tactics, faith is something different, and you don't have to be loyal to a man in a dress or a building to believe in something. The institution has nothing to do with what a person believes in.
Joe Moe
Thanks for the reply Ice!
Which, for me, was a magical moment.
To the original poster: thanks for sharing your opinion. It's nice to hear a xian speaking out against idiocy. I'm sure your opinion is not warmly welcomed with many of your fellow xians, but I'm glad to have heard it.
I share his frustrations. Even though K and R realize they are bad at debating they decided to get spanked anyway and make Christians look ignorant. GRRRR.