Jesus
Offline Jesus is a hundred thousand times more introspective, insightful, and reasonably calm minded then any tool on this board. You guys all just refuse him simply because his community absorbs him and consumes him and butchers his teachings. You think that christians are a direct presentation of christ. But just as Gandhi once said "I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians, they are so unlike your Christ".
You guys so boldly claim that "all religion is hocus pocus nonsense" and falls under the weight of science. But you never gave an honest interest into anything but your blind refusal to our community of Christians. Opening your mind is to see beyond your self, and this means to stop filtering everything with your ego. Everything I said has been picked apart by all of you, and nothing has been heard. My words do not mean what my words say, my words mean what I intend them to say, but words can carry many different connotations, you think you have absolute knowledge of words and insight, but your warped minds twist what I say into meaning something other then intended.
what a bunch of kids, a playground of kids is right, just as lux says.
I say this because it is an honest observation, and not all honest observation is soft and gentle. You guys have judged me as a person who "believes in god", and as such all ideas you have about people you have colored me with, without listening to me on my own accord.
"does god exist" = stupid argument. How much more do you need to process? if you think this is a productive question, then you are an idiot.
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By the way, you guys so adamently absorb Socrates work, but you forget the socratic method to answering all questions is to respond with another question. You guys have answered a question - "Does god exist" - with no, and thus, refuse the socratic method. By saying "no", instead of asking another question, the socratic method has stopped. Youre the same idiots that christians are for giving an answer to that question. I never gave an answer, by the way, I gave conjectures to both answers.
Actually most of us when asked "Does god exist?" would respond with a question. I would ask "I do not believe so. Can you provide me evidence of him? That is logically consistent?
Do you realize you keep running around this board saying "whaaa whaaa, no one is listening to me"? Maybe if you weren't screaming so loudly for attention people WOULD listen to you. You talk about people here needing to grow up, maybe you need to check the mirror because you are acting like an infant.
Bgh why is it so common for projection to be used by theists? I see it all the time. I know self defense mechanisms are used and all but it seems like thats the main one.
Also in case you didn't realize, i'm saying he's projecting.
I believe it is a defense mechanism when one's beliefs are challenged and the person then has a hard time actually rationalizing or defending what they believe or it is taken as an insult.
I am no psychologist though, maybe Todangst has a better explanation.
http://www.rationalresponders.com/psychological_defenses_projection_identification
Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin
http://hambydammit.wordpress.com/
Books about atheism
Great... Thank you very much Hamby!!
And seriously, how many topics does it take to make the exact same point (if you could call random insults a point)?
Wow, what a wonderful way for you to circumnavigate the own barriers and recesses of your own mind, to project that idea into me. You have not heard what I have said to you for what it was, or what was intended, "for you have become like those who either love the trees and hate the fruit, or love the fruit and hate the tree."
My first post, and the consecutive 40 posts were sound and reasonable, nobody heard them, you guys rejected me before I rejected you. You asked the question "does god exist" and I gave you a sound hypothesis to coincide withy our own science and yet, you still have not heard me, for you simply are just refusing to believe anything that doesnt fit your childish egocentric agenda. i have not come in here with beliefs or convictions, I came in here with hypothesis and you guys all judged me just as you are doing right now, and you have been doing ever since. There are a few people who obviously dont fit this bill, to them I apologize that they must be associated with such a segregationalistic community. hate all and refuse all who believe in god, welcome all and worship all who dont, all the whole while not realizing your own leanings of mind and prejudices. You are not battling evangelism america, you ARE a crucial part to evangelism america. If nobody is opposing evangelism, evangelism will crumble, but when we embrace the evangelists and inquire with our own sense of authority, then we can dissolve the segregation
You seem so adament to fight fire with fire, but fire begets fire. Now, there is no scientific hypothesis to support this belief, so maybe you should perform some of your high and mighty empirical observation, and decide what it is that destroys fire. To me, I see water works, but sand and dirt can also work, we should perform some tests that can lead us to absolute facts, like science is so great at doing... till then, we are content to fight fire with fire.
idiots.
"Does god exist" = dumb. Somebody tell me how this is even minutely productive. Let me give you a hint - its not, your attacking the fruit for its poison, but you do not see the disease within the tree that creates that poison, so you have become a poisoned tree to counter the poison of the other tree..
you ever hear the expression seeing the forest for its trees? learn it. You are sticking to your tree - convicted in it, and not seeing any other tree. You guys are a cult, Dawkins and Harris are two such high priests. Your rationalizations are known for being what they are, you circumnavigatingyour own minds and finding insane justifications to justify your own negative affluences. You guys are like little kids.
by the way, look deeper into the socratic method, the socratic method is not to just have an answer until somebody has a better answer and then formulate another question. it is quite plainly, straightforwardly, answer a question with another question.
OK, I will agree with you that God exists if you can explain to me how the Christian God is the correct God, and where he comes from in the evolution of religion, which when broken down to it's simplest looks something like this:
Animalistic Religions > Polytheism > Monotheism
It isn't until what? 200BCE that the Judeo-Christian God comes into play? (When the Tanakh is cannonized) And ~30CE when it morphs into Christianity?
What about Zues and the Greek Gods and their Roman adaptations? They've been around for far longer! By ~435BCE large stautes were being erected of Zues!
How about Hinduism? It's been around since ~3000BCE! Far longer than Christianity! So doesn't their philosophy have a much higher regard than something 2000 years later?
Why would an omnipotent being wait 2000 years and say "Hey guys, I'm actually the only God, you should worship me instead!"? You can't answer this question. Why?
Because religion is part of the human psyche in which our ancestors looked to supernatural powers to explain the answers to their questions. Man created Gods, not the other way around. This is fact.
YOU shut the fuck up! WE'LL save America!
Nuh uh! You started it! Nuh uh!
Geesh man. You aren't even trying to conceal your bad attitude now.
Uh uh, and the fact that you have been questions multiple times on your "sound" conjecture and have NEVER made any effort to answer the questions or clarify makes no nevermind to you eh?
Just so I'm clear, what are you doing right now? Fighting fire with compassion?
Ah yes, now I see the kindness and compassion in your words. You have shown me the light.
I see, so I should use your superior approach then?
Ok, you're an idiot.
That any better? I want to be really good at what you're teaching us so help me out if you think I"m doing it wrong. I could call you childish or ignorant ... should I do that too? Seriously, I'm really interested in learning how to have inner calm and compassion like you.
The hindu god, is the same god of buddhism, is the same god of christ, is the same gods of paganism and zeus, is the same as evolution and life in atheism, is the same as consciousness in psychology, is the same is the same is the same. I did not come in here to say there is a "right" god or a wrong one, most religions take the attitude that they are all one in the same.
here - reference this - wikipedia under hinduism
"In contrast to the scriptural canons of some religions, the Hindu scriptural canon is not closed. Hindus believe that because the spiritual truths of the Vedas are eternal, they continue to be expressed in new ways.[86] Some Hindus even venerate the scriptures of other religions. One much-quoted verse from the Rigveda that emphasizes the diversity of paths to the one goal is:
This openness means that there is little theological quarrel between Hindu denominations[87] although these denominations may view God and their notions in a different form or sense."
I told you I appreciate all religion, so why do you guys assume that I believe in just one? I think the supernatural explenation of Jesus birth and death was symbolic of the meaning of the eternal holy spirit, not that it actually happened that way in the literalistic sense. The "virgin mary" was not literally a virgin, how could she have conceived? Virgin in this sense, was just born of a pure mother, and into a pure family... Virgin Mary was a virgin of the mind, not of her sexuality. Thats my stance, but did anybody care to listen to that conjecture? No, they assume that I believe in god, that i must also believe in all these absurd notions as well. You guys are so full of preconceptions its repulsive.
Form is emptiness, emptiness is form, they are one in the same. all things arise from emptiness, and all things return to emptiness. So, how can they be different from each other, if they all share the same source? The earth arose from emptiness, and it will fall with emptiness, just as the sun, the moon, jupiter and pluto, and you, and me... we all come from emptiness, and to emptiness we will return.
First, I will say that I have yet to meet a theist that agrees with your point of view.
Second, there is no possible way that all the deities worshipped by theists are the one and the same, the Judeo Christian God. This claim is so outrageous, but I don't have the time to go through the lengthy arguement of why.
Religion is a tool of humanity.
YOU shut the fuck up! WE'LL save America!
Youre the only tool here, buddy. Heres the thing - one body, many rivers. All the deities point to the same thing, of course they arent literally the same thing - youre looking at two people pointing to the moon and of course they arent the same people, but its the same moon.
jesus? oh, yeah. that guy that's just a composite of Attis, Mithras, Horus and Osiris, right? yeah, he's pretty special, as far as carbon copy saviors go.
"never gave an honest interest into anything but your blind refusal to our community of Christians"??
you do realize 99.9% of the people here are former christians who know more about your religion than you do, right?
yes, questioning god is much more productive than the blind acceptance that you embrace like a gullible schoolboy.
www.derekneibarger.com http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=djneibarger "all postures of submission and surrender should be part of our prehistory." -christopher hitchens
haha
I am not a Christian though, any more then I am an atheist, or a buddhist, or a hindu, or a muslim, or a sikh, or anything else. I learn from all tongues even if a tool like you only sticks to the one in your close little comfort zone.
You were so quick to spit your venom at me, but you had no idea what I am even about. You can not know me by my labors, you can know me by my fruits, that means my expressions. So perhaps if I didnt tell you that I believe that God literally made the world 7000 years ago, if I didnt tell you that I believe Jesus is the literal son of god and the Bible is the innerent word of god, perhaps you shouldnt assume it about me, you just made yourself into an asshole. I seriously doubt any of the kids on this board could school me on christianity though, bud, they may have memorized Titus better then I, but I have a true understanding of christs message, thats something that doesnt happen a lot either... So please, try me... Without your stupid preconceptions.
Seriously, why did you call it "my religion" - because I like christs message, means I believe everything that the dogmatic christians do? Maybe you should chill out.
I've been wondering the same thing. It's downright freaky that projection seems to be the most utilized tool in a theist's limited arsenal.
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This is the last time I respond to you, Anbesol. I will not tolerate petty name-calling from some punk kid who thinks he can look smart with simple analogies.
None of what you have said has refuted the FACT that religion was a man-made concept of which man created Gods to explain the natural world he had yet to understand. Theism is simply a hangover from our past.
Your analogy of two people pointing at a moon is fallacious to compare it to Gods. The difference? Moons exists. Gods do not. The fact of the matter is you are just as insignificant as I am, and we are but specs on a tiny spec in a universe. You are made up of molecules of carbon and other elements from this earth, and when you die, you will be broken down into these elements again.
Plain and simple, you are delusional and should seek professional help. Your projectings of needing attention are quite annoying and I urge that you take care of that and move on with your life. I, for one, am not going to sit here and debate with someone who is going to resort to petty name calling when he can not refure a point.
We'll say that all religions are right. They all contradict each other, and they all want to prove each other wrong. Zeus, Allah, God, Hades, Vishnu, Shiva, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster are all the same deity. Right. Then, I also am a deity, because I will now claim to be and start my own religion.
I'll even go so far to humor you for a moment, and pretend that you're 100% right and a deity that created the world is the same that all these religions. Then, why are they all fighting about? Why hasn't said deity show itself? Is it dead? Is there a heaven and a hell or reincarnation? Is there no afterlife? If no one can know, then what is the point of worshiping a God?
The answer: there is none. There is no reason to believe a God(s) exist. If one does, he/she/it/they have given us no reason to spend billions of dollars, kill, hate, worship, etc in it's/their name. It would be pointless to do so, and we should then stop and religion should die.
That's if you're right. We arrive at the same conclusion, because I believe that religion will die because we are evolving out of it. There is no need for a God in a world where we understand the natural occurances our ancestors looked at and said "goddidit!"
Please grow up, this is the last thing I will ever say to you because you are quite a waste of my time, effort, and brain cells.
YOU shut the fuck up! WE'LL save America!
Anbesol, you never answered my question about the basis of your eccentric Christian views. You're positively at odds with the mainstream of all the major sects I've heard of, yet you offer no scriptural foundation to support your claims. As far as I can tell, your complaint about atheists is simply that you feel they've closed their minds to certain ideas, or have unjustified certainties. Yet, if they followed your example, which is simply not to substantiate anything, they would be totally justified in doing so.
First you want atheists to pretend to be theists to undermine religious institutions, and then you want them to become agnostics for reasons that have never been explained. Now you're throwing out ad hominems, and siding with some Catholic with a soft focus picture for an avatar. Your views have become erratic and incomprehensible.
Anbesol and the RRS have parted ways. I don't think your answer will be coming.
What a double standard! If an atheist went around hijacking threads, insulting everyone he came across, and never presented even a shred of logic you wouldn't ban THEM!
You heartless BASTARDS!
Anbesol and I were just becoming close. I think ... I think I was falling in love with him. Something about the way he called me an idiot over and over again, it just did something for me.
But you ruined it.
I am so sorry, I did not realize love was blossoming.
I can only give you words of hope and let you know, there are other fish in the sea and I am sure there will be other trolls running around here calling us idiots in no time. Keep your chin up and remember he probably wasn't right for you, sure he called you an idiot over and over but did he really MEAN it? It may have been something he just said to make you feel better. Sorry.
Ad hom in profusion.....it is starting to look a lot like trollmas everywhere I go!
Damn! Those last three posts left me rolling.
"It's beginning to look a lot like Trollmas" Now THAT'S funny!
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You sound like a 3'10" migit standing spread eagle in front of The Rock(pro wrestler) shouting, "Dont hit Jesus, you might hurt him".
Yea, Jesus was so insightfull and introspective that he couldnt figure out how to convince us with out using a puppit lemming like you.
DAMN! You got me. Right after we discected a frog in highscool biology we speard one of our clasmates and let the blood drain out of their body, then we stuck em on a slab and waited three days and they got up and danced the jig. Standard lab experement, my bad.
Oh yea, and we also had to identify spirt sperm under a microscope too. On top of that since we all got "A" on our test a 4 armed teacher was followed into the next day's class by 72 virgins. MAN I LOVE BIOLOGY!
No, only kids need to be bribed and threatened to do the right thing. I am 40 and dont need Santa for adults. Maybe you do, but I dont.
You say this because you are honestly deluded. Go pray, pray till the cows come home. Pray untill you are blue in the face, and we will still exist. The reason you repeat this behaivor is not because magic is real. The reason you repeat it is because you want it to be real. We cant help you out of that delusion unless you want help.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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Damn, BGH, not only do you have good taste in music, you're also hysterical. I nearly spit tea all over my keyboard!!!
If god takes life he's an indian giver
I know. That response was truly magical.
that really sucks that he got banned, or rather, that he got himself banned. in between all the "you are all t00lz and i am your intellektual n3m3s1s" there was some stuff i was actually interested in reading. what an asshole, to have something worthwhile to say and fuck it up by barbing all the comments. anbesol if you're still reading, you fucked up man. elenchtus usually doesn't involve ad hominem, at least not in any practice of it i've seen.
sophist: "what is the meaning of god?"
socrates: "what do you mean what is the meaning of god? are you an idiot? can you not even think existential and walk at the same time? how many sophists does it take to screw in a light bulb? why are you such an asshole? why can't you just fuckin get it? fuck, why am i even wasting my time with you anyway, dolt?"
sophist: "um. was that serious, or just a joke?"
note all the questions inherent? note how many of them were productive? so here's a little bit of elenchtus for you anbesol, to consider when addressing people to whom you wish to converse:
what's the best way to say hello to somebody you've never met, if you wish to continue sincere, thoughtful conversation?
it bears repeating: what an asshole.
if (born++) {truth=null};
imaginary