I have been discussing athiesm with my brother on email, he is thiest i am strong athiest. I post this because i know that in becoming an athiest is sometimes hard and traumatic but it is for the better.

For me coming to terms with the nonexistence of an after life and and finding a reason to go on as a living being was exceptionally difficult. A person cannot really be an athiest and believe in an afterlife, they also find it difficult to find purpose in life.

If you can make it through the "Agnostic" or middle ground position, without going insane
and realize like i did that there is no god/or after life then you will be ok, but what helps is to have a purpose. I have a beautiful wife and a genius one year old son, they keep me going.

here is the email volley, (chronologically latest to oldest)

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!

Puckit!

Now we're talking.... Disctinction! (I've decided I won't put a finite numerical value on a theory.)
There's some good shit in your email, good reading. I'll respond in detail later cos I've got some work to do now.

Deuks

On 30/05/07, J Jacobs > wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: J Jacobs [ ]
Sent: 25 May 2007 10:34 PM
To: '
Subject: RE: the meaning of life

Let me start with "I can't get pissed about the atheist/creationist debate,
I appreciate the score (1 out of ten) I haven't answered the question for
you, I will get to it.

1 I didn't say life's purpose is to beget life I said "life begets life" it
does it without a sense of purpose, except maybe in a hormonal sense but
that is a survival mechanism evolved from: the species with the greatest
drive to breed, breeds more readily and has a higher chance of survival due
to sheer numbers, on the other hand the hit and miss method of tape worms
also works they make then million eggs per worm per day something has got to
stick they have bad numbers though for every 1 egg that matures to breed
several trillion die. Tape worms are a form of life do they have a purpose?

Pa (bless his soul) always asks "if we are descendant from apes then why are
the apes still here?" same question you just asked. Last time I heard him
ask that question you were there, at spur, now I avoid getting into a debate
with pa because he gets hectic unpleasant, he thinks you are arguing, or
attacking him. So I didn't afford him my answer, one that is quite obvious
really.

A species is not like a generation in that when a new generation matures the
old one dies, (I can't believe you asked that question or that I am
explaining this zero points fyi ) the first step in the dog was man
domesticating the timber wolf and breeding in certain traits, obedience,
loyalty, ability to learn, we now have several hundred subspecies of timber
wolf that we call dog, oh yes and the timber wolf, why did the timber wolf
remain,
Or the pheasant that became a chicken or the boar that became a pig,
And why did the little wild animal that the domestic cat originally came
from go extinct?

If an animal is in area "a" and fully populates area "a" and a small
contingent moves to area "b" and adapts extensively to area "b", do all the
original animals in area "a" go extinct immediately? No.
If some of the animals in area "b" move back to area "a" and adapt back to
area "a's" conditions do the animals in area "b" go extinct because of
animals readapting to area "a"? no.
When the animals from area "b" readapt to area "a" do they revert back to
exactly what the were originally? No they become a third species.

I remember what Charlie Bolton said on his farm about the monkeys and
baboons on the farm and why he had to put strong security measures around
his borehole pumps "They have nothing to do and all day to do it in" he
said.
I remember thinking there and then that it was because life was too easy for
them, they forage for an hour all together in a day and wreak havoc for the
rest of the day,
We might have evolved from them, only if chimps evolved from them, we almost
certainly evolved from chimps, almost. Not entirely sure, maybe baboons
evolved from chimps, one way and people from another way, but the chimps and
the baboons remain.
Now is being human better than being chimp? Depends on what environment you
are in, remember man is a tool using animal without tools he is nothing and
with tools he is all.
Chimps can't thrive in Antarctic at all, but with tools man can. Man can't
thrive at all without tools. We are too week and too slow and we lack
stamina.
Orangutans are ten times as strong as a man under normal conditions,
Cheetah 4 times as fast
Elephant has size,
Flee has antisize,
Polar bear has cold,
Yak has altitude,
Mosquito has blood,
Tape worm has gastric juice,
And fly has shit,

Fish has water,
Bird has wind
Mole has earth
Man has fire

Every life form has, has its niche, sometimes there is enough niche to
accommodate thousands even millions of diverse species,

Compare us with crystals? Organic/inorganic well organic chemistry is all
about carbon based molecules like CH4 methane and CH3-CH3 ethane and
CH3-CH2-CH3 propane and CH3-CH2-OH ethanol etc, so carbon crystals?
(I am being an arsehole now splitting hairs about the definition about
organic and inorganic I know)
If I assume your meaning correctly then you probably mean "Animate" or
"Inanimate" the occurrence of simple methane does not require "life at all,
ever. Unless there is serious life on Jupiter, Saturn, Neptune and youranus.
And I am sure, I will bet my dick there are more complex gasses and oils as
well.

Now is a dead body "animate" or "inanimate"? what makes a dead body be
"alive"? (soul and mind are fiction like god and magic) explain the presence
of life inside an autonomously animated conglomeration of complex molecules
and "organic" systems without referring to "soul" or "mind".

You said what?
In life, our life, it is only with guided persistent action that a steady
state can be achieved.

That is a deeply profound statement, I read it once gasped for breath and
read it another five times. It resounds in my head like a statement or quote
that I read in a motivational book like dale carnige or Robert keyosaki, is
it your own original? did you just coin that one from the top of your head?
That is deeply profound, (no sarcasm seriously). I digress.

Is war order? Every human wants to control their environment, and most
humans do, we are not a perfect species, we have issues with moderation,
War is a symptom of change, it started with the neighbor feud, then the
village feud, and almost always the one who started the fight wins, it is
inbred. It has been proved that homo erectus was forced to extinction by the
hand of homo sapiens. We competed for the same area and resources and won.
They were stronger we were cleverer. War is just a big feud. Many times the
outcome of war is order. The British colonies were won at gunpoint, the
British then built, schools and post offices and libraries, the Catholics
built monasteries and convents and orphanages, then the colonies were lost
at gunpoint, autocracy took over from monarchy (the natural evolution of
government)then democracy took over from autocracy (the natural evolution of
government)
I think war is a disease like flu or depression, or malaria, it's one of the
things we need to work out as humans.

Science is not perfect and science knows that science is not perfect,
That's why there is "law" and "theory"
If a Christian writes a science bashing book the author always gets the
whole fact (law) and "suspected fact" (theory)mixed up.
There is no big bang law or expansion law or law of relativity,
A theory is an unproven idea usually with a lot of evidence to support it.

A religion is an unproven idea with no evidence to support it. (the
existence of the universe, earth and life, is not considered evidence)
The mere existence of the bible does not in it's self prove that it was
written by a god, the words in the bible that insinuate that the bible was
written by a god does not prove that it was written by a god,
And the verses in the bible that say "have faith" or "live in faith"
Basically mean "don't question what we can't explain"

I agree with you that I like things to make sense,
I wish the fairytale of a god were true, it's a sweet story
I wish the fairytale of santa clause were true, that's a sweet story,
I wish there was life after death, that would be cool
I wish there was no death, that would be cooler,

I tell you a story that few people know.
When I child is small one of the most traumatic things for them to learn is
the reality of death, it is so traumatic that it becomes almost essential
for a parent to tell them the life after death lie, I will tell my son that
when the time comes otherwise he won't sleep at night.
There is something more traumatic than that and it is when an adult realizes
that there is no life after death and no point to life.
It took me a full 4 years to make peace with it.

Religion tells you what you want to know and science tells you some of what
you need to know, science doesn't have a truth about every problem but
religion certainly has a lie for every problem.

Religion teaches good and bad morals, religion teaches people to love and to
hate, it teaches freedom and oppression it teaches unification and
segregation, oh and religion is the greatest cause of war.
Even the America vs. Iraq is a religion thing. If Iraq was Christian or
Jewish or if America was Islam it would not have happened I bet my Dick.

To answer your question about the meaning of life.

Life in general has no purpose, and no meaning, it is wholly and solely up
to you to find a purpose for your life and to pursue it with rigor and
verve, and make sure that your purpose adds meaning to your life, make it
selfish make it all about you, its in our nature as humans. Be the Albert
Einstein, the Neil Armstrong, the pharos ramsees, the Nelson Mandela, let
your name resound in histories untold and unwritten, be the one that history
books are written about, let them name a planet after you "Daniel Jacobs
Prime". Whateva.

Bro Jo

Up is the opposite of down
Cold is the opposite of hot
Light is the opposite of dark
Wet is the opposite of dry... blah blah you get the drift everything has an opposite.

But what is the opposite of life?

Answer: Chaos

"No" I hear you say! "it's order"
Well what is the height of order?
Answer: Life!

Let me explain a little how my thinking works, (none of what I write here is from someone else it's all my drivel (as Athur Geldenhuis would say)

If you put carbon in a perfect order you get diamond, (carbon crystal) that is the simplest form of order in the universe (more ore less, let's not argue) but not one of perfect shape, the absolute perfect conditions are needed for that.

Try a more complicated piece of natural order, H2O crystals and Potassium permanganate Crystals, Everything has a crystal form.

Now what happens when you put together a very very complicated molecule, Dioxy rhibo nucleic acid for instance?

Under the absolute perfect conditions you would get a crystal.
But under other conditions they will do other things and combine with mytocondea (sp?) but they will replicate and form big and small groups,

They don't want to replicate they just do.

Crystals replicate themselves poorly even fairly under certain conditions,

Trash begets trash, order begets order, life begets life.

We are only a naturally occurring state of order gone berserk because the conditions have been right for so long, now here we sit questioning it.

If there was no war there will be no word like "peace"

Planet earth will eventually go extinct but life will go on.

I also believe that the hight of boredom is eternal life in a place that is perfect I am nothing If I don't have a problem to solve.

I believe in evolution, but the most interesting way I have begun to think about it is not where we in our evolutionary process comes from but where we are going, we are a few steps up from the original human but we are still changing, Intelligent people breed with intelligent people, poor with poor, healthy with healthy, diseased with diseased, astronauts with astronauts, engineers with engineers, change will come, but when we start understanding it better we might get it to do better.

See ya,

Greetings and love for Sarah, respond often I love this stuff.

PS: SCORE THAT

-----Original Message-----
From: daniel
Subject: RE: the meaning of life

I would give you a rough score of 0 out of 10

I asked what is the meaning of life, not what is life.
ie why are we on this planet, what is the purpose to our existence, what is life for?

Do You want to know the meaning of life?
Or is this a rhetorical question?

Oh what the hell! Brace yourself here it comes…

Life [lahyf]
–noun

1 the condition that distinguishes organisms from inorganic objects and
. dead organisms, being manifested by growth through metabolism,
reproduction, and the power of adaptation to environment through changes
originating internally.

2 the sum of the distinguishing phenomena of organisms, esp. metabolism,
. growth, reproduction, and adaptation to environment.

3 the animate existence or period of animate existence of an individual:
. to risk one's life; a short life and a merry one.

4 a corresponding state, existence, or principle of existence conceived
. of as belonging to the soul: eternal life.

5 the general or universal condition of human existence: Too bad, but
. life is like that.

6. any specified period of animate existence: a man in middle life.

7 the period of existence, activity, or effectiveness of something
. inanimate, as a machine, lease, or play: The life of the car may be ten
years.

8. a living being: Several lives were lost.

9 living things collectively: the hope of discovering life on other
. planets; insect life.

10. a particular aspect of existence: He enjoys an active physical life.

1 the course of existence or sum of experiences and actions that
1 constitute a person's existence: His business has been his entire life.

12. a biography: a newly published life of Willa Cather.

13. animation; liveliness; spirit: a speech full of life.

14. resilience; elasticity.

1 the force that makes or keeps something alive; the vivifying or
5 quickening principle: The life of the treaty has been an increase of
. mutual understanding and respect.

1 a mode or manner of existence, as in the world of affairs or society:
6 So far her business life has not overlapped her social life.

17 the period or extent of authority, popularity, approval, etc.: the
. life of the committee; the life of a bestseller.

18 a prison sentence covering the remaining portion of the offender's
. animate existence: The judge gave him life.

19. anything or anyone considered to be as precious as life: She was his
life.

20. a person or thing that enlivens: the life of the party.

21. effervescence or sparkle, as of wines.

22 pungency or strong, sharp flavor, as of substances when fresh or in
. good condition.

23 nature or any of the forms of nature as the model or subject of a work
. of art: drawn from life.

24 Baseball. another opportunity given to a batter to bat because of a
. misplay by a fielder.

2 (in English pool) one of a limited number of shots allowed a player:
5 Each pool player has three lives at the beginning of the game.

–adjective

26. for or lasting a lifetime; lifelong: a life membership in a club;
life imprisonment.

27. of or pertaining to animate existence: the life force; life
functions.

28. working from nature or using a living model: a life drawing; a life
class.

—Idioms

29 as large as life, actually; indeed: There he stood, as large as life.
. Also, as big as life.

30 come to life,
.

a.
to recover consciousness.

b.
to become animated and vigorous: The evening passed, but somehow
the party never came to life.

c.
to appear lifelike: The characters of the novel came to life on
the screen.

3 for dear life, with desperate effort, energy, or speed: We ran for dear
1 life, with the dogs at our heels. Also, for one's life.
.

32 for the life of one, as hard as one tries; even with the utmost
. effort: He can't understand it for the life of him.

3 get a life, to improve the quality of one's social and professional
3 life: often used in the imperative to express impatience with someone's
. behavior.

3 not on your life, Informal. absolutely not; under no circumstances; by
4 no means: Will I stand for such a thing? Not on your life!

3 take one's life in one's hands, to risk death knowingly: We were warned
5 that we were taking our lives in our hands by going through that swampy
. area.

36. to the life, in perfect imitation; exactly: The portrait
characterized him to the life.

Try to
remember it.