If you think only the South has idiots you're a fucking moron.

You remember how many American high school students can't find the US on a map? What was the percentage of Americans who believe in evolution vs the percentage that believe in Creationism? George W Bush was elected as president. Twice. Look at how little the average American understands science (see some of the posters on this site.) When there was a blackout a few years back the power company employees mentioned 2 incredibly stupid questions they heard a few times - "how will I know when my power comes back on?" and "If there's no power how do the cars have headlights on?" Even knowledge of a much closer country is terrible - I've heard Canadians say they were asked by Americans if they lived in an igloo or if they ate moosemeat sandwiches every day. Look at the idiots that point to a particularly cold day in the winter as "proving" global warming not true. Yeah, the stupidity in this country appals me, but we do have some very intelligent people.

Hey! I had a moosemeat sandwich on Monday. I smoked a moose roast this past weekend. It was damned good.

A friend of mine drove a tourbus in Alaska. She was asked such probing questions as:

While picking up the tourists from the cruise ship, standing on the dock: "How far above sea level are we?"

While looking at Denali: "How much does all that snow weigh?" (Which isn't stupid, just ridiculous, I guess.)

Then there's, "Do you take American money?"

Or at a postoffice, after the clerk handed them some American flag stamps: "Oh, I'll need Alaskan stamps for these. I'm putting them in the mail right here."

Or just as you said, Matt: "Where are the igloos?"

Or while taking a tour of the pipeline, after a talk about the use of heat radiators to protect the permafrost: "So, how did they install the permafrost?"

And so on.

People ain't bright.

A minor (make that major) correction. The Bush family is anything but Southern. Research this a bit. "The more you know!"

I am, however, with you in spirit 100%. PREACH BROTHA PREACH!!!!!!!

EDIT - fixed quoting

PLEASE people preview your friggin posts!!!! I am tired of fixing retarded mistakes that a simple preview would show you and you could fix it.

- dead_again

*Grins*

You're fucking good.

However, GW was born in Connecticut.  He's a damn immigrant to Texas and the South.

It never ceases to amaze me how I can take one concept and make it fit in several different topics.  Over in the Science Fiction debate thread, I mentioned that humans like to think that they're breaking free from their instincts, but they're not.

The vast majority of people are stupid because our genes don't care if we're smart or not.  I'm using smart and stupid colloquially here.  Sure, our genes want us to be able to have abstract thoughts and be able to deal with complex cultural interactions, etc... but they don't really give a damn if we can summon the intellectual fortitude to recycle aluminum cans or vote for whoever runs against the Republican candidate.

If you think about it, there are many more logical ways to do things than what humans do.  We're just here for the genes, after all.  As long as they're reproducing themselves effectively, we'll continue to be pretty stupid as a species.

She's not necessarily stupid. She's uneducated. There's a difference. It probably has far more to do with our horrible education system rather than "dumb" genes. I'd say we should make all these people go back to school until they can answer basic questions like whether or not the sun orbits the Earth but, until we fix our schools, that won't do much good.

True about the education system. I had teachers that taught things I later learned were false - within the subject they taught. Unfortunately, unlike college professors the emphasis on teacher degrees is on "teaching techniques" instead of knowing the subject matter. When they have subs it's even worse - I remember having substitute teachers that could barely speak English, there was an older man who said he was a Vietnam veteran and Vietnam was "fun" - he also was very strange and likely mentally ill. Basically at least in PA all you need is a certificate and you can literally substitute teach any subject, including one you know nothing about. I was out sick when it happened in Jr High, but it was during history of the different religions the Math teacher (who was a goof himself) subbed for the History teacher, and spent the entire period speaking about how wonderful Christianity is and how great it was to be a Christian (oh if I had been there and knew what I knew now - can you say lawsuit? Hello FFRF and ACLU!) Imagine how bad it would be if Christians had their way and their idiotic view of science was taught everywhere - science is already not a good subject in general in the US. I personally feel the Average Americans knowledge and understanding of science is on the lower end of what an elementary school student's should be. Who knows what it will take - after the Scopes Monkey trial in the 1920s things were kind of the same, until the Russians launched Sputnik and our government figured out it might be a good idea to teach our students science that at least met 19th century standards. Christianity has been an utter disaster towards the understanding of science for nearly 2 millenia now.

/Rant off.

I just can't understand how it's possible to believe that sun orbits earth or earth is under 10k years old. But looks like I overestimate people.

I wonder if she thinks Jean-Claude Van-Damme is the best American martial artist as well, since he did an incredible job of portraying one in films . . . got the accent down and everything . . . .

To a certain degree, I agree with your argument that gender stereotypes are culturally endorsed (ie. Paris Hilton, Britney Spears, etc.) and the xenophobic tendencies towards people who show intellect (ie. the dork or nerd carricatures). But these cultural stereotypes are not exclusive to the USA. For example, in India and to a certain extent in the UK, Bollywood stars are extremely popular and contribute to similar gender stereotypes. Every girl wants to be sexy like Ashwairya Rai and every boy wants to be macho like Shah Rukh Khan. But inspite of this, I don't see any appreciable cognitive decline among the masses. In fact, in Southeast Asia and in Europe, more and more individuals choose professions which require rigorous (often brutal) training in the maths and sciences and only a select few get jobs in those respective fields (eg. IT industry) based on high standards. It is quite unlikely that those folks will believe the earth is flat. So why is the US different?

The way I see it, there are 2 reasons. First, math and science are not valued in American society at all cultural levels most likely because people find those subjects hard. For example, you don't have to take calculus or geometry in high school. Transcendental numbers such as pi are reduced from 3.14159 26535....etc to 3 to make life simpler for students. Second, American culture has evolved to celebrate mediocrity and forgive those who lag behind. Everyone deserves a gold star. In the past, if a high school student said that the sun revolves around the earth, he/she would be publicly humiliated. In our PC laden culture, we don't want to lower an individual's self-esteem. We don't want to hurt anyone's feelings by pointing out that he/she has perpetual brain farts. Stupidity prevails in this milieu. And this is manifestly worse as you rightfully pointed out when the masses are blindly patriotic along with unquestioning obedience to religious doctrine. I wouldn't want these folks to reproduce to prevent them from spreading this meme (not their genes) to their children. And please, they should never be allowed into public office.

in my high school there were multiple routes in which you could take for all of your subjects. in math and science there were either applied, Normal, and advanced. I was in the normal for both. But i never had to do Calc due to the fact that only the people in the advance lane were the only ones who had to do it... I basically stopped at geometry after 2 years of ALgebra in which i really only needed one year. Science was taught only by science teachers if one teacher was sick and there was no subs that knew how to teach science one of the other science teachers would take our class into there's for the day to teach that way we never lost anything. i really and truthfully feel that the reason our country is the way it is is because they let students off so easy with the normal subjects. There were other paths a student here could take where they only had to take the 4 main subjects in the morning/afternoon and the rest of the day they would be at the career center where they would learn a trade be it welding, automotive, or whatever. i can understand if a student was doing something like that if they wanted to take the easy way out, but that still their choice.