Why the omni-god claim is pissing me off right now!
Offline Mind you, you always hear those stupid arguments "its a test" refuring to suffering in life. Ok, here is what I would say to a diety if we are to take one for the sake of argument only.
"Listen you asswipe, you got a beef with me, take it out on me, why does my mom or my mom's dog have to suffer?
My mom's dog loves me and always wants to please me. She(the dog)has twice had a colon infection, the first bought of diarea only lasted a day, but this time it has been almost two days. The thing is she is almost 13 years old and still displays happyness and doesn't really seem to be in decline. But I wonder if this continues what kind of mental effect it will have on the dog, which would effect my mom.
My point is, I am sick of super natural claims trying to explain the natural. My mom's dog is old, and I also am afraid of what would happen to my mom phycologically, so I feel responsible, even if it is beyond my control.
What kind of sick claim is it to postulate that emotional torture is part of the "test". My mother has suffered the deaths of two of her best friends over the years, and the death of her Assisted living mate. Now her dog, which I am taking care of for her, is having chronic problems. If such a claimed prick(deity) had it in for me, why take it out on them, why not just take it out on me?
I am venting right now because I am tired of seeing my mother suffer emotionally, and she puts on a much braver front than I do, but I cant help think that it takes it's toll no matter who you are. I simply want her to be ok, and I feel like I am failing in taking care of her dog for her, even though that is probibly not the case.
My mom has done for me more than any person in the world and loves me no matter what. I simply want to give what I can back, even if it is not much, and taking care of her dog is the least I can do.
I want to punch the wall right now because my mom and my mom's dog deserve better than nature has given them.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
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I know what you mean, I've always seen it like this: If there is an all powerful god, he can do things that don't make any sense to humans. He can also do wild things like contradict himself, he is, after all, all powerful. I've brought this up to people, and they basically argue that without suffering we can't understand joy. My counter-argument is that if it is a truly all powerful god he could have created us in such a way where we would not need suffering to understand joy, thus undermining the existence of an all-loving, all-powerful god.
I do understand where you're coming from, its tough to watch someone you love lose everyone and everything close to them. My great-uncle's going through a pretty bad situation, in the last three years he lost his two sons, and his wife divorced him and conned him out of a decent sum of money while she was at it. Its ridiculous, and of course his wife is pretty strongly Pentecostal, but what can you really do eh?
If you're gonna punch the wall, just don't break a knuckle. You need those.
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The moral of the story of Job is to stay away from godly men. God always gets their friends first.
On the lighters side, god is only interested in crapping on the friends and family of righteous men. So you can hang around righteous women all you want but of course their righteousness is inversely proportional to the reasons to be around them. But it is safe.
So to get this god off your back, go visit a prostitute, gamble, charge interest on money, maybe even worship an idol. I prefer a Mr. Hankey idol myself. That will get the god off your back.
Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.
www.ussliberty.org
www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html
www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml
Brian, you're doing the best you can. It has no sense to be depressed because you can't do more than is possible. Look at Mother Theresa. She was surrounded by suffering and dying people. If she would sit still in depression, or would break her hand by hitting a wall, she couldn't help anyone. She felt the emotions, but she reacted on people's needs and didn't allow the emotions to hinder her from the work.
As for the suffering, it is a result of our life style. We are responsible for most of the things happening to us. I mean, we as the humanity. No-one is separated and actions of others affects us. This is why we must see all people as one family and must care for each other. Some people doesn't realize, that a released load of a toxic waste for saving some profit is an equivalent of taking a thousands people into a torture chamber and torturing them to death. (which is a metaphoric equivalent of premature, painful and diffcult old age and dying) This sense of separation between people is thus rightfully called a crime and sin. Even if there would be a God, don't expect it to do much with that. Saving humanity totally from consequences of it's actions would be an infringement of free will and it would make impossible for us to stop doing things like that, in the first place.
Yeah, I'm curious how my mouth full of smart-ass talk will feel when someone close to me will suffer like that.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.
what actually put the first crack in my faith that caused it to come crashing down is somewhat similar.
A good childhood friend was abused by her parents while young... she always came to me when feeling like shit. She came to me with suicidal thoughts when we were both like 10 years old. she later learned she was adopted and her biological parents ended up staying together and having more kids and being a decent family.... but they gave the first one up for adoption. This was about the time I was in love with jesus christ and thought he was the solution to all problems.
Like a good christian person I thought this was all just part of god's plan to bring her to me so i could bring her to God. When i started working that way she started thinking of me completely differently. When i started pressuring her to come to my youth groups and catholic retreats she just stopped seeing me as someone who could help her i think... When I talked to my youth minister about it she tried to convince me that I did everything right and she failed some "test."
That was it!!! I couldnt take it anymore, I remember just unleashing on my youth minister. I was so angry to hear her say that this was somehow all her fault!!
I started to wonder if everything really was going according to some plan.
This all caused a downward spiral of connected events that separated me from her, and brought her to an even more miserable life with another guy who treats her like shit, and she just accepts it because she is so used to it. As my love for jesus faded I began to realize how much i loved her, and I learned that she liked me way back when. Now its way too late, we have went our separate ways and are hundreds of miles away, damnit...
This has all proven to me that things don't go by some divine plan. In fact religion got in the way, in fact religion got in the way from the plan we could have created ourselves together!!
She deserves so much better than she has right now!!! But now that my eyes are opened i don't see some plan coming together, now that my eyes are open i'm scared to death for her... I'm scared what is going to happen to her. It makes me scream out loud sometimes.
A universe that doesnt give a shit about human emotion makes a lot more sense than an omni-god who doesnt give a shit about human emotion. I find it a lot easier to believe that my scream isn't heard, than to believe a God who loves me is listening and has some secret reason for not reaching down and fixing things or at least telling me he has a plan.
i couldn't make that leap of faith anymore if i tried
Bad example. Read the post about Adroit. Mother Theresa belong to a cult that caused the very suffering she claimed to be trying to end. Delusions can be harmfull and mask themselves in psuedo empathy. Mother Theresa's problem was that she didn't realize or didn't want to face the fact that her faith was part of the problem, much like Adroit's faith drove a loved one away from him.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Hmmm, I dont see any evidence to support what you are saying. I dont think there is some self seperate of my mind in the same way i dont think there is a God and the universe...
true i cant explain a lot of stuff about the mind but i'm not going to just accept something spiritual because of it.
I cant explain a lot about the universe so i'm not going to just accept some supernatural being did it.
Brian, I'm not very good at this sort of thing, but you have my best wishes for your mother and her lab. I hope it goes as well as it possibly can.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Well the dog seems to be comming out of her inner ear infection and her poo is solid now. I am sure my mother feels better now. I feel lots better now, but it is still hard to face the reality that illness and age catch up to all of us eventually.
Thanks for your words of support.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Adroit,you should try to contact her, its worth a try.
marshalltenbears
Change your avatar to Maximum dimensions are 154x191 and the maximum size is 30 kB immediately
please
People who think there is something they refer to as god don't ask enough questions.
Btw, spirituality is a bit different than you think. It is everything, what leads to an evolution, development or improvement. For example, scientific work, diplomacy or activism. It's the evil religion what usurped the notion of spirituality only to it's sets of belief and practices for many centuries. In fact, spirituality, the evolving principle, should return to every area of human life.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.
That would make her an even more spiteful bitch than I had already considered her to be. She wouldn't even have an excuse anymore.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Of course it is a protective mechanism... Feeling detached from the mind due to emotions makes complete sense and can be quite useful. What doesn't make sense is thinking you are detached from the mind just because there is some mechanism that emotionally detaches us when we need it.
The ability for a mind to believe its body can fly, doesn't mean that its body can fly.
The ability for a mind to feel detached from itself, doesn't mean it is detached from itself.
if you want to continue this debate... well I don't want to.
but i will, we just shouldn't do it here.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.
The universe is set in motion and is allowed to run within certain parameters.
God does not manipulate every atom, or beson, nor every life on this ball of rock in space.
There are those who for lack of understanding think God is the source of their troubles, and they forget about their blessings.
We are the cause of our problems because we (humanity) can not follow a few simple rules, thou shall not, led into by honor your Father and Mother. If we were to love our neighbors as we love ourselves, crime, war, and other violence would stop. The general stress level would decrease and much disease with it. Cancers and similar diseases are because we ive longer, praise God for more than three score and ten. Your mother and her dog are part of the natural order, we are all born dying.
When we die is based on how we and others live.