obnoxious.
Offline I was walking back to my dorm through the cafeteria while talking to my girlfriend on the cell phone.
I heard a group discussion about the bible up ahead and i told her "just a second" and walked by quietly.
the conversation wasn't private or anything, I just wanted to be courteous. regardless of what my opinions are.
It got me thinking, a few weeks ago there were a few people holding a gay pride flag. and next to them was a priest or a deacon had a hastily made sign that said "HOMOSEXUALS, FORNICATORS, AND MASTURBATORS, WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD, PREPARE FOR HELL."
I say to my friend, "isn't that obnoxious?"
"Yeah, isn't that a gay pride flag?"
as an atheist i am very polite about standing against theism, yet i'm usually considered to be obnoxious about any statement against it.
In the same way these gay pride supporters are just standing up for themselves, but i imagine most people passing by are irritated at the flag rather than the sign.
Meanwhile, Bill O'Reilly invites people with oppositional views to him onto his show so he can spew out his opinions at them.
And my parents probably think, "Thank God for Bill O'Reilly."
Maybe i should start being more outspoken.
What would you guys have said to the preist with the sign?
"Uhhh, you forgot shrimp eaters on your sign, its from Leviticus"
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For a start, yeah. Maybe I would have put that on a sign and stood next to him.
As for being polite and courteous, I don't think that telling people to PREPARE FOR HELL is very polite and courteous either. It's nothing more than an insult, inspired by sadism. Sadism pride, so to speak.
If "being obnoxious" means "not being of the same opinion as Bill O'Reilly", then yes, we should all start being more outspoken.
I'm most certainly a militant Atheist/Anti-Theist and have no remorse in being that way. I get so sick and tired of hearing all og the religious garbage almost daily and having it thrown in our faces, all the while being expected to keep our mouths shut as to not offend the theists. They have that invisible wall of demanded respect and and sympathy surrounding them, and I want nothing more than to tear it down. I say, be as obnoxious as you feel, because it's your right. They're expressing theirs, and we can never make any progress if we sit back idley and let them spew their nonsense without showing them how ridiculous it is. I just went through this with my states elections, they were hoping to legalize gay marriage. I'm all for equality, plus my little brother is gay. 85% of the oppositions funding came from the mormon and catholic churches. That kind of shyte doesn't sit well with me. So to the priest, I would have pointed out all of the hypocrisies and BS surrounding the issue. That his Jesus never mentioned anything against homosexuality, and that in the New Testament there are only 3 possible verses in the entire things that could even remotely pertain to homosexuality, all of which are debatable and most likely do not refer to that at all. I also would have pointed out all of the fornication within their precious book. And I may have let him know that these people don't need to worry about inheriting the kingdom of god, because it doesn't exist. From there a whole new discussion could get started and if you know enough you can make him look foolish in front of his flock of sheep. I have lost friends and offended plenty of people by being so vocal about my Anti- Theism and have come to realize, that I don't want to be surrounded by delusional people anyway. There are plenty of Atheist Libertarian around that I can make plenty of likeminded friends. And as far as offending people, well, if they get offended maybe they aren't so strong in their faiths. I discussed this all with a theist that I know and I told him, I'm either going to change your mind and make you realize how silly it all is, or I'm going to strengthen your faith. But by using reason and logic, it's usually the former that we get. So I say, don't hold back, express yourself and your beliefs, because they are going to do the same thing. You can't win if you don't fight. Just my opinion.
"I'm most certainly a militant Atheist/Anti-Theist and have no remorse in being that way. I get so sick and tired of hearing all og the religious garbage almost daily and having it thrown in our faces, all the while being expected to keep our mouths shut as to not offend the theists. They have that invisible wall of demanded respect and and sympathy surrounding them, and I want nothing more than to tear it down. I say, be as obnoxious as you feel, because it's your right. They're expressing theirs, and we can never make any progress if we sit back idley and let them spew their nonsense without showing them how ridiculous it is."
Took the words right out of my mouth. There are theists that are or at least try to be polite, and it's best to return the favour. But the hate mongers are worth shit, and should be treated as such.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Once someone sets the table, so to speak, by being 'in-your-face' or obnoxious then they lose their right to kid gloves handling.
I am fairly polite up to the point where someone gets jiggy, then it's on.
How can not believing in something that is backed up with no empirical evidence be less scientific than believing in something that not only has no empirical evidence but actually goes against the laws of the universe and in many cases actually contradicts itself? - Ricky Gervais
I recently had a conversation with a down-pat christian theist who had any amount of dogma to throw about - an answer for everything - not a real answer but a forceful unpleasant answer. This included the bits about judgment, hell, and deserving to be burned and tortured - all the way down to youngish kids and teenagers, etc.
The justification being that god's justice is so pure he cannot actually forgive sin and somehow jesus (also him) intercedes and does it for him. Oh, the semantics.
I harp on about this I know but it's at this point with the hell thing that the most loving christian loses me to the red eyed monster. A christian who insists on this sick and twisted business while moaning about how worried they are gets me into an eye for eye mode.
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck
The disparate reactions are what bothers me.
Dixie Chicks say they are ashamed Bush is from Texas and people burn their cd's and call them traitors. People call Obama a secret terrorist or kenyan or whatever and they are given more air time.
Kanye West says Bush hates black people and he becomes hero, Kanye West interrupts Taylor Swift and becomes zero. All the while, still a racist douchebag.
Ted Haggard speaks against gay marriage while huffing meth with a gay masseur, he gets a new flock of followers and will probably get a whole new church.
Gradually, I'm starting to accept that what I've always considered to be crazy/irrational reactions are the ones that we should be expecting.
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They are terribly misinformed. Bush is from Connecticut.
He's just a yankee immigrant to Texas. I do agree us Texans need to develop a more strict immigration policy.
"I am an atheist, thank God." -Oriana Fallaci
i was also wondering if to be more out spoken
I'm usually polite and respectful with others who are polite and respectful.
I think that usually if you don't take it carefully people will just shut down and not listen to you, then you can't reach them at all. Just politely give them as much as they can hear and then give them time to think about it. Rock their faith just a little and make them think. They sometimes even come back to ask more questions.
As far as the idiot with the sign.. depends on the mood. I am most likely to just walk past because it is a waste of time to confront fundies, they don't listen.
But if you want to annoy him just walk up to him and politely say "you make me sick" and see shere it goes from there.
Zen-atheist wielding Occam's katana.
Jesus said, "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division." - Luke 12:51