Picked Up a Dan Barker Book

ZeppelinKapft
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Picked Up a Dan Barker Book

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And I'm enjoying the book. I like him much more than I did Richard Dawkins, who struck myself as a bit smug. Contemptful, even. One idea in particular however stuck out at me, and that was Dan Barker's loyalty to the truth.

I'm not so sure that truthfullness automatically should recieve the highest rung on the ladder. Well, the idea of the ladder itself is a little bit sacrilegous in itself. But essentially, I see the scientific community struggling with very esoteric questions. These questions are very challenging and very difficult. We are basically starting to run up against the upper limits of our own human abilities, and the only way for ourselves to continue to advance is to start manipulating with our genetic code or start altering our biochemistry--essentially tinkering with what makes us, us.

As controversial as that might turn out to be, I won't comment on the appropriateness of doing that or not. But I would like to point out that I think the idea of progress that we are pursuing is an illusion. I am not saying that this is so, but it might happen in the near future that being an atheist might be equivocated with being an advocate of unbridled progress.

And yet, to get caught up in such progress without realizing the immediacy of where one is as one is-- is to follow an illusion. I think atheists believe that mankind has some ultimate destiny to unlock the secrets of the universe. There's some burning desire to want to know and to want to question. I'm not advocating that we stop, but I think we should recognize that there is no Manifest destiny of such a sort--just as there was no such original manifest destiny of the original west. To believe that there is, is to be a horse chasing a plastic carrot.

What I liked about Dan Barker's book, however, is his embrace of certain values, the fact that he still has a certain fondness for his Christian Past. His kindness and gentleness. He preaches not because of others, but because of hisself. I guess that's why I like him so much: Because his activism is more a part of him, than it is about converting or correcting Christians.

I'm certain not many christians have thanked him for his pursuits. Then again, reading his book, I get the feeling that he's not in it for the converts.

 


Atheistextremist
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I like Dan Barker, too.

 

I heard a radio interview Dan did with a theist preacher and it was most absorbing. He is gentle and most persuasive and his inside knowledge is lethal. The point you make about the burning desire to unlock the secrets of the universe does not depend on atheists thinking humans have an ultimate destiny to do so. I think I can speak for many other atheists here when I say we are driven by a hunger to know provable truth. At the same time, many admit they believe many of the biggest mysteries may continue to elude us. The key element of this is a refusal to accept dogma on the basis of faith or threat.

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


BobSpence
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Atheistextremist wrote: I

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

I heard a radio interview Dan did with a theist preacher and it was most absorbing. He is gentle and most persuasive and his inside knowledge is lethal. The point you make about the burning desire to unlock the secrets of the universe does not depend on atheists thinking humans have an ultimate destiny to do so. I think I can speak for many other atheists here when I say we are driven by a hunger to know provable truth. At the same time, many admit they believe many of the biggest mysteries may continue to elude us. The key element of this is a refusal to accept dogma on the basis of faith or threat.

I certainly agree, and for many of us, the pursuit of truth and understanding of 'Life, the Universe, and Everything', as far as we are able, is the driving force, and Atheism is typically one of the first by-products of such a search, rather than being the primary motivation.

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


Strafio
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I've got the book Godless.I

I've got the book Godless.
I find his personal story really interesting.

I like how his detractors try to claim that he was never "really" a believer, that the 15 years or so of devoting his life to Christianity was just an elaborate hoax...


Brian37
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Strafio wrote:I've got the

Strafio wrote:

I've got the book Godless.
I find his personal story really interesting.

I like how his detractors try to claim that he was never "really" a believer, that the 15 years or so of devoting his life to Christianity was just an elaborate hoax...

That is because of the bullshit "True Scotsman" fallacy, even atheists fall for.

There IS  a difference between what one projects on others as to what their ideal to a label should be, AND the actual label the person ascribes to in their own head.

If for example only, someone claiming to be an atheist went into a movie theater and mowed down 50 people, I would not say "They weren't a true atheist". I would say they were one fucked up human being

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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