Real Christian/Real Atheist
Offline from anti-faith
For the heck of it I will post this from thier atheist forum. No response yet.. I been there for a while now. It is hard to follow a discussion with everybody the way thier set up is.Quote:Theist asked:
Now this question has been growing & growing. Over three quarters of atheists in here are ex-christians, of which many seem to have a very mixed up view of Christianity. So 2 questions crop up:1) Where they real Christians previously - I'm really suspicious in a lot of cases.
2) Are they real atheists now (or do they just harbor grudges against God and hence have huge axes to grind) ?
I posted:
Not all Christians are on the same page, so that might be why some non-Christians or ex-Christians misunderstand. I am a pacifist and so are my family. They are Evangelical Friends. But other Christians thinks war is ok for Christians...1) Maybe some were and some were not. I felt like a Christian when I was one. What does scripture say a real Christian is?
2) Maybe some do and some do not. Maybe some harbor grudges against what other Christians did, maybe some became atheist through philosophy. People are different do you not agree Theist?
What all does scripture say about people who do not believe in God? How much scripture addresses your questions?
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Happiness is a choice. A state of mind. Serenity feels joy even with simple things that are easily within ones grasp.
i think what we need to understand what's going on here when a theist asks these questions... they're trying to formulate an excuse so they can still believe in their god. because to them it's just so impossible that a christian would fall from faith....
but i'm of course curious as to how others here respond to this as well..
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1. That is a No True Scotsman Fallacy.
2. That is also a No True Scotsman Fallacy, but seems to imply atheist just hate god. If they hate god then they probably aren't atheist because they have to believe it exist in order to hate god itself. However they could hate the idea or the actions of those with the idea/because of it.
To me this who thing sounds like that atheist don't exist bullshit.
True Scottsman Fallacy. Cool.
Yes many kinds of Christians do not want to believe that a sincere Christian can lose Faith. Some Christians considered me a heretic
when I was a Christian anyways and so of coarse I could lose faith because I had no real relationship with the Lord anyhow. No True Scottsman fallacy. Faith is feeling and all it takes to be a Christian is to accept Jesus as Lord and Savior.
I see the reasoning behind the original statement.
A lot of anti-theists (getting technical here...) are former Christians. Now, as to whether they were Christians in the first place, the only one that knows is them (and God
).
But the problem here is that a lot of people turn from Christianity because of what people do. Often times, I have found that when I have had problems in my life, or was struggling with something that was destroying me inside that was considered a sin, "Christians" around me would only look to judge or tell me just how wrong I was.
I think Brad Stine said it best when he said, (and I paraphrase) that we need to stop judging and be real. When someone comes to you and say they have been having a problem with pornography, don't say, "well you are just wrong, and that's evil, and blah blah blah..." Be real. Be honest. Say, "I have too. (if you have that is...)" That's honesty. That's integrity. That's the honesty that EVERYONE (not just Christian people) tend to lack in this world.
Who is more irrational?A man who believes in a God he doesn't see, or a man who is offended by a God he doesn't believe in?-Brad Stine
The reason why atheists deny God is that they can't stand the fact that there IS someone more powerful than they are.
I think apostates are not all the same in how they came to lose Faith.
For some it could be anger at God. ( Life not being what we would expect if there was a God.)
For some what other Christians have done.
For some rejecting the bible after having read the whole thing a couple times.
For some dabbling in philosophy.
Maybe a combination of some of these.
Who ever said that atheists are more honest than Christians? Not me. I believe that some of us try our best theist and atheist alike. I am still against religion, but not against people.
You realize that there are still churches that deem other denominations as not real Christians? Some pastors flame other denominations?
Many Christians make up excuses as to why it is that some people who believed lost faith.
Um.....Jesus supposedly forgives sins. Are you saying that people might lose faith because of christians pointing out their sins?
I was talking about religious bigotry between Christian denominations. That is still a problem...
Yes what other Christians do. What advice/help does the bible gives to a mother who is beaten by her husband in front of her child? Things like that really can test Faith.
Why do I get the feeling that you really do not care about the real reasons why people lose Faith...