First of all Void, and you may know this already, her use of the term "paganism" is a gross missuse of the word. Paganism is an umbrella term used to describe a group of religions that that have a commonality, much the same as the term christianity. There are many pagan religious sects, just as there are many christian sects. Secondly, the fact that she is selling these kits is absolutely inane, and abhorent since she's praying on the gullibility and ignorance of the people who actually fork over the cash for one these things. The use of "magic" or "magick" or "magik" (I've seen it spelled all three ways, and all are generally held as correct) is applied in paganism, but in the exact same way prayer is applied in nearly every other religion. A pagan "casting a spell" is the exact same thing as a christian praying, just a little more elaborate in some cases. I think I'm going to write this bitch and give her what for! lol If you find any other rediculous "pagan" claims, send 'em my way. I used to be a pagan priest, so I have a unique insight as to how to debunk their particular claims to authenticity.

As for atheist in a box, what would be in it?  I say we just send out empty boxes, and charge like $500! 

This is not Paganism.  This is just another person who has figured out that there's more money to be had in lying to the credulous and gullible than there is in getting off your ass and doing something useful.

Most Pagans do not believe that magic can be bought and sold. 

I will say this in her defense, however.  I believe that her spells are every bit as effective as the prayers recommended by the more mainstream religious traditions.  And at $297 it's a bargain compared to tithing.

Thandarr 

Paganism is a large umbrella term for pre-Christian nature worship or Biophilia. They do not believe in magic, and a genuine pagan would consider the wiccans a bunch of freaks whose ability to exploit people's  religious fallacies for money is like a failed version of the unfortunately succesful televangelist venture.

Actually, the term "pagan" was invented by the medieval Christian church as a descriptive term encompassing all non-Christian religions and ideologies.  Thus, Wicca is indeed a pagan religion.

Oddly enough, those whom I personally know that practice Wicca rarely purchase anything from anyone.  There is a general tendancy to distrust objects that are for sale.  So the kind of gullible person that would buy such things is going to be someone who collects "magical oddities", not a practitioner of Wicca.  Sort of like someone who collects Christian artifacts and maybe believes in Christianity but neither goes to church or practices Christian rituals.  You know, someone who believes that merely having objects supporting a belief is enough to prove it.

People just get stranger everyday.  It's like the braincells of the ignorant are being taken and distributed to a minority of highly intelligent people who then get more intelligent whilst the rest of the population becomes progressively dumber. 

Yes I am aware of what this is. I did compare her to a con man and allude to the idea she was doing something with it.

The claim that "pagan" was invented in the Middle Ages to refer to all non-Christians is not very accurate. Pagan is used to refer broadly to polytheism, in any of its basic incarnations. An Muslim (Mohammedans, as the medievals would say) is not properly a pagan, nor is a Jew.

Yours In Christ, Eternal Wisdom,
StMichael

http://www.religioustolerance.org/paganism.htm

That is more accurate in the derivation of the term "pagan." The term being invented in about the 4th century. It most often refers to polytheism and nature worship in their many forms, as the article says.

Yours In Christ, Eternal Wisdom,
StMichael

I just want to point out that the phrase was not used in this way. You can read many different etymologies of the word, "pagan," and it doesn't generically refer to all non-Christians. There are many classes that all differ from each other: Jews, heretics, schismatics, Muslims, atheists, and pagans. They are not all referred to by Christians of any time by the blanket term "pagan." It is just a manner of accuracy in using the term.

Yours In Christ, Eternal Wisdom,
StMichael

It seems that the only people who are not pagan in the narrow sense are Abrahamic. And in a broad sense anyone who isn't following the true god. The site does say it was used for polytheism, but it seems in the broad sense hellfiend could be correct.

Atheists are not pagans, nor are agnostics, or deists. Pagan is a reference to natural/polytheistic religions. It has nothing to do with a designation of going to hell or not; in fact, the term comes from the word "rustic." Even if someone is Catholic or Christian, they can still go to hell. The term itself says nothing about the fate of their soul.

Yours In Christ, Eternal Wisdom,
StMichael

I could play devils advocate and defend my ex-pagen status if the convo get's interesting, lol.  Thusly providing a proper viewpoint from which y'all can debate, ifn ya want.

Btw, Void, I did write that woman.  In the hopes of drwing her into a debate, I told her I had been a Wiccan preist for many years, but nothing of my status as an atheist.  I also told her she was, "selling spiritual enlightenment like an infomercial", along with various other colorful expletives.  I have yet to recieve a reply.

Hellfiend I'd bet $666 dollars you know more then me on this subject go for it. If you are going to talk from the pagan view point I suggest you use Pagan_Hellfiend tags. Also Hellfiend if you ever get something back and write a blog about it I'll link it from the top.

BTW St. Michael I do agree with you as far as today is concerned.

$666, ha, that's hillarious dude! If and when i recieve a reply I probably will write a blog about it, but if it hasn't happened yet, I doubt it will. She's either ignorring me completely, or knows she's been called out and has no foundation for an argument. Either way though, she's ignorring me, lol.

I don't see the need to use a different moniker to cary on a convo on the topic. If you do, feel free to tell me why. I also see no glarring inaccuracies in anything anyone has said. All the points expressed so far are true, the word "pagan" is pretty vague in it's original meaning and application, but is used in a specific manner to denote a specific group in modern vernacular. I have frequently seen the term "neo-pagan" used as well, and perhaps that is a more accurate way of describing the modern incarnation of these religions.

I thought you meant going into a character so sorta like.

<christian_void>Proof for god? Well um, what if YOU'RE wrong!?!?!</christian_void> 

The very fact that she makes the claims she does about casting spells shows she isn't a wiccan. I wasn't ever one myself, but I did do some examination of it at one point. And I've never known a wiccan who would try to use a spell for love. It's against the tenets of the religion.

Vastet, you are partially correct.  Casting "spells" for love are acceptable, so long as it isn't directed at an individual, thereby trying to impose your will upon that of another.  If a wiccan were to cast a spell for love, the kharmicly correct way would be to say, "send love my way", rather than, "I want Shelly to fall in love with me".  In any case, I agree.  I don't think she's for real either.