A question to all Atheist & Theist
Offline I am rather new to this site and feel at home already. I would like to know how other feel on the issue of grave plots. I know morbid right..
- Do you want to be buried or cremated?
- Does it mater which way you face?
- Do you feel it ok to let a corpose take up that 4'X10' piece of earth for hundreds of years?
I just want to see how many people out there have plans made. I know that some just fall into what ever mom and pop bought for you, but really give it some thought.
Throughout human history as our species has faced the frighten terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are and where we are going; it has been the authority (the political, the religious, and the educational authorities) who have attempted to comfort us. By giving us order, rules, and regulation. Informing or forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question these authorities. THINK FOR YOURSELF…
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Offline I enjoy old cemeteries too. I think the new flat-headstones-in-the-middle-of-a-golf-course types are horrible. I want crypts, fading 1,500 pound tombstones and looming statuary underneath ancient oak trees.
Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.
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Offline I enjoy old cemeteries too. I think the new flat-headstones-in-the-middle-of-a-golf-course types are horrible. I want crypts, fading 1,500 pound tombstones and looming statuary underneath ancient oak trees.
Around here it is ancient Douglas Fir. But yeah, the new ones are bad.
In Yuma, AZ, there are two cemeteries. The "Old" and the "New". My great grandfather is buried in the old one. No grass, only rocks and sand, Tamerisk (which the locals call "salt cedar" ) and Mesquite (sort of like Acacia) trees. Some of the graves are outlined in fist sized rocks. Some only have wooden crosses for markers. Very old western. The new cemetery is just across the road - watered lawns and trees and flat grave markers and plastic flowers. My grandparents are buried there. I have only visited the graves once as it is so very depressing. And I have no feeling of connection to my grandparents there. They are dead, there is nothing to connect to after all.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
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My plan : http://www.bodyworlds.com/en/body_donation.html
Cremation all the way.
I plan to donate my body to science - if I die here in Portland, OR, that will probably be Oregon Health Sciences University (OHSU). This is the least expensive option for your heirs as the institution won't pay for your body, but they won't charge anything either. I think even transport is paid for by the institution you donate to.
If I don't have any takers, cremation. Cremation is less expensive than burial, though it isn't free. (My mom cost me about $1100 US.) The only problem here is what to do with the ashes. I scattered my mom's.
Why there are regulations surrounding scattering ashes I don't know. You would think a lot of very small bone chips that have been heated to a lot - I haven't looked it up - would be no more problem than the bone meal you buy to put on your garden. I wouldn't expect my heirs to put my ashes on the mantel or to scatter them somewhere special or to pay for space in a mausoleum. Told my husband to do what he damn well pleases - I would be dead and couldn't give a rat's ass anyway.
Burial in the ground? Yech.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
Hi.
1. Definitely cremated. It is my information that buried corpses pollute the soil with germs and toxins accumulated in life. It would need a few centuries of only cremating people and not burying them, for the soil to purify. In this way, occurence of diseases would decline.
2. The facing direction of a corpse is irrelevant. But for the bystanders' convenience it would be better to choose the traditional upward direction.
3. No, as I said, cremation is more hygienic. It also takes less space and is very quick. And cheap. I never liked wasting money. Grandchildren would surely find a better use for them, than spending them all on funeral decorations. Here the cheapest choice costs about 800 USD.
Basically, these things are for me just questions of proper waste disposal. As a member of general woo community I expect to be eventually reincarnated into a new body. It's not a pure belief, we work with that concept a lot and have some personal evidence that it works. My mom was a regression therapist, for years she introduced people to their past lives and deaths. No big deal, the greatest problem is usually to live well and get done everything you should, so you won't have to bother with it in next life.
Well, at most, I'd wish that some scientists would take a look on my post mortem brain, if I wouldn't get to that in life. In that case, they should print out the results and spread them on some visible place
I estimate that right hemisphere is very lazy and left hemisphere is overworked.
Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.
1 - Cremated.
Part of the ashes dumped in Ocean off Daytona Beach, some on Las Vegas Strip, and some in assorted Adult Night Clubs all while mourners are partying.
2- See #1. As my ashes would be in multiple states and in the Gulf Stream or simply be swept up by street sweepers don't think it matters.
3- Whatever works.
I worked as a grave digger when I was 18, you want to talk about morbid.
____________________________________________________________
"I guess it's time to ask if you live under high voltage power transmission lines which have been shown to cause stimulation of the fantasy centers of the brain due to electromagnetic waves?" - Me
"God is omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent, - it says so right here on the label. If you have a mind capable of believing all three of these divine attributes simultaneously, I have a wonderful bargain for you. No checks please. Cash and in small bills." - Robert A Heinlein.
Burial. I don't care what happens to my body, but my wife is sentimental about corpses, so I'll let her do whatever she wants to and that means being in the dirt.
And if my wife dies first I'll still be buried, because I'm sentimental about my wife.
Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.
1) Taking a third option, I want to be blown up, as a fan of spectacle I want my funeral to let me do one last great show. Though my organs, nerve tissue, etc. will be mostly donated to medical research and use for others.
2) only in the context of what the explosion would cause
3) I don't know actually, I never really thought about it.
I don't care. Do whatever you want with my body, just make sure I am completely dead first.
........cremation isn't cheap, $900 for my spinster aunt they insisted on burning her and the casket at the same time, the bitch wasn't even dead, my brothers and I had to hold down the lid untill she stoped pushing it open. We had burnt fingers. It's unbelievable how some people just don't want to go. Baby brother Shawn finally wacked her with a hymnal, it went smoother after that.
we had a heated family debate with mom dad and their seven kids & 6 adult grand children about where to stick them after death. Mom insisted it should be AFTER death (shes so pickie sometimes). No problem Shawn used a hammer this time and she's buried in New Brunswick. Dad I think is still hanging around a mortuary some where, no one can remember if he was buried or not; I think he was dead. Maybe not.
"Very funny Scotty; now beam down our clothes."
VEGETARIAN: Ancient Hindu word for "lousy hunter"
If man was formed from dirt, why is there still dirt?
And I already bought the plot in a churchyard near my place in the country. The land could use the enrichment. And as Beyond Saving said, make sure I'm dead.
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck
I was wondering how many of my fellow atheist would have either not made up your mind or in the I don't care category. Cremation is the only way to go for most of us. You don't need that piece of land forever... As for the toxic mater in our body's, well the shit that come out is the most harmful so why don't you just stop eating Luminon. Although i do like how fast and Strong you were about the answer. People that show up to funerals in a prius should have there heads examined.
Throughout human history as our species has faced the frighten terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are and where we are going; it has been the authority (the political, the religious, and the educational authorities) who have attempted to comfort us. By giving us order, rules, and regulation. Informing or forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question these authorities. THINK FOR YOURSELF…
I don't know, cremation seems like such a waste. I don't understand why we can't just feed our bodies to the dog, or pigs. My dog used to like bones, if I had died first I'm sure he would have enjoyed chewing on them. I always threw him bones of animals I killed, whats the difference?
If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X
Well, strictly speaking, I have given my brother instructions to donate me to the nearest police academy for dog training. They will cut me up into small bits and bury me in many graves on the land around the place. It will take a few years before they let the dogs sniff all of me out.
That being said, I suspect that he is going to put me in the family plot, if for no better reason than my name is irrevocably on the specific grave site and it can't be used for anyone else.
As far as donating your body to science, my father did that. You need to know that eventually, the med school will be done with the body and you will have to figure out what to do with it. Despite being an atheist, he was also a war hero, so he ended up with a huge deal at Arlington. I don't think that that was part of his plan.
=
Whatever is cheaper. All that really matters when I'm gone is that my family spent as little money as possible on my funeral so that they are better taken care of since I am gone. That being said I am 20 with no kids and no wife, so I say that assuming that I have a wife and kids. If I were to die today, just burn what you can and bury the rest in the back of my grandmas farm land cause I can't afford the picture of the casket.
As far as which way I face. My favorite answer is, of course, Bob Kinight's. Bury me face down so the whole world can kiss my ass! But really, I have never given it any thought honestly. Just assuming that face up would be easier for an open casket funeral.
And do I feel it's ok? I do. I feel like the family should keep up with the grave marker and make sure that it is honerable to their dead member. My family actually started a local activity of adding flags to dead veteran's grave sites. I come from 3 generations of military men and countles relatives as well. After one memorial day of putting flags on my anscestor's graves, my father and I began to notice other veterans whose graves appeared to not have been looked at in years, including a few who died in battle (one was even honored for his bravery in death after his platoon was cut to 8 men, and was ambushed by 200 Veitkong. They managed to hold them off til reinforcements got there). So no we set flags at every grave we see that indicates military service. But taht is beside the point.
When you're dead, its not like you care. All that matters is the people you leave behind. In my opinion at least.
My Master has no desire to be merely victor in a debate: he did not come into the world to fight a battle of logic just
for the sake of winning it. --Charles Spurgeon
Cremated. I wouldn't want my family and friends to waste money burying me. They could spend that money on food or donate it to charity instead.
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
My plan is about this:
1) I do not care. You/my family/etc. are free to do whatever they want with my body.
2) If I die and meet a god or an evil ... then I will FU^K them for ETERNITY until they turn time back and build a mausoleum on my grave.
I think you left out the popsicle option.
Neither cremation nor burying make much sense. It makes more sense to use any partially dead body for medical experimentation. Any fully dead body can still be used by medical students.
Finally, fermentation and extraction of biofuel, perhaps- although there's really not all that much energy in dead bodies (given the rate of death for humans) to make use of.
I will be dead and at that point what happens to my remains won't matter to me. HOWEVER, having one's wishes followed up is natural. It would be more of a request to respect those who survived me who were close to me.
I want to be cremated simply because it is cheaper. Spending money on things like weddings and funerals can only be justified when one is honest about it. These are things we want, not things we need. Memorials and celebrations are not events that sustain us like food or paying bills. They are merely social events. Although socializing is part of our evolution and is part of our survival, cost can become and is often an absurdity and obscene in these cases.
I think it is a horrible scam to convince someone to pay 5 grand or 10 grand for a box no one will see after it is put into the ground. I think it is absurd for someone to pay 10 k or 20 k for a dress they are only going to wear once, which doesn't even mean a marriage will survive.
So if those who know me want to honor me after I die, don't spend a ton of money memorializing me. Stick me in the oven, and sprinkle my ashes somewhere Darwin has been. And after all the crying is done, have a party and a roast of me. But again, it wouldn't be so much for me, because after I am dead, I wont have the capability of giving a shit. But I do care about those who will want to memorialize me, so for them, not me, I would hope my wishes were followed.
AND FYI, to all reading this, as an aside. If I ever end up a vegetable, pull the plug. Even if I ended up in a state where my brain was aware but my body didn't work and my voice didn't work, I would not want to be trapped in a prison without being able to communicate.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
And that is another good point. Yea, on second thought, donate my body to science. But whatever tissue or bone or parts of me that cannot be used cremate.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Brian37 wrote:
AND FYI, to all reading this, as an aside. If I ever end up a vegetable, pull the plug. Even if I ended up in a state where my brain was aware but my body didn't work and my voice didn't work, I would not want to be trapped in a prison without being able to communicate.
Good point for the last question who has DNR's signed?
Throughout human history as our species has faced the frighten terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are and where we are going; it has been the authority (the political, the religious, and the educational authorities) who have attempted to comfort us. By giving us order, rules, and regulation. Informing or forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question these authorities. THINK FOR YOURSELF…
I'm donating my body to science, what can't be used will be cremated and then they can do whatever with it.
And yeah, No vegetable for me, My DNR is signed by the way.
A DNR alone might not be enough. I would strongly recommend a living will as well and have someone you trust appointed to make the decisions. I went and got one during the whole Schaivo thing because my parents made it clear they would do anything to keep me alive. I also do not want to live as a vegetable, especially if I am not quite vegetable enough and am still aware.
If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X
I think that organ donation is more useful than sending your body to a med school. After my organs are removed though, I want to be cremated on a huge oak funeral pyre at the top of some small mountain. And then I want festivities to be held in my honor that include the massive consumption of alcohol and a little bit of food.
Here we go, aquamation!!!!!!!!!
http://www.mmdnewswire.com/alkaline-hydrolysis-centre-9756.html
I like the auqamation, sounds good to me. This is where I was going with this post. Ideas, good and bad are always nice to hear. I had hoped for more views from the "other side", however this is a good start. We all need to think of our impact on the environment for the sake of our children and grandchildren. Now as for the DNR early in life I would like to be revived only if there is no serious brain damage. Which my wife may say already exsist, kinda of a preexisting condition.
Throughout human history as our species has faced the frighten terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are and where we are going; it has been the authority (the political, the religious, and the educational authorities) who have attempted to comfort us. By giving us order, rules, and regulation. Informing or forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question these authorities. THINK FOR YOURSELF…
But, if anyone can find any useful spare parts, they're welcome to them.
Deosn't matter to me...I'm dead.
“Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.”
In my last gesture of kindness towards humanity... I would like to be cremated so as to not take up space, but not before donating whatever organs I have that could be of use to somebody else...
I want my friends to have a drunken sex filled party in my honor, and no matter what you all do... *Do Not* feel bad for me... I have an amazing life... Oh, and dont keep me on a mantle... keeping ashes is just f'ing stupid...
www.RichWoodsBlog.com
Love the response hit the nail on the head!!!
Throughout human history as our species has faced the frighten terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are and where we are going; it has been the authority (the political, the religious, and the educational authorities) who have attempted to comfort us. By giving us order, rules, and regulation. Informing or forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question these authorities. THINK FOR YOURSELF…
I am torn in that I would definitely not want to risk being locked-in but I think the idea of being supercooled and brought back someday is getting increasingly probable. If it didn't cost as much (probably about $200-300 per month for life right now to join) I would definitely give it a shot as long as I wasnt locked-in when I woke up as a failed experiment. Also, I don't know how they could afford to bring people back even if they had the technology. There is a trust to pay for your expenses over the years but its probably not enough to actually bring you back. Its not that I want to live especially long but I would like to see the future even if only for a week or so.
When I die, I suppose they could chop me into aand use me for fertilizer. I've always wanted to get gloriously fat, so that in the case I am cremated, it'd be one big grease fire!
“Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.”
Cremation.
My ashes worked into the soil of a cornfield ~ still have to find a farmer that will do it.
Slowly building a blog at ~
http://obsidianwords.wordpress.com/
Since I was a kid, I've always been enthralled with cemeteries and graveyards.
First choice would be to be buried in an old German Catholic cemetery in Philadelphia, because I love the gothic stones. I am not german, nor am I catholic (anymore) but I'll be dead, so I won't care about that. Direction wont matter. I won't be able to see anything anyway. I think using the space is fine. I love cemeteries, especially old ones, and I hope they stay for many years.
Second choice, which I understand is far too expensive for me, would be to have myself freeze-dried and mulched. I'd like to fertilize an apple tree or some such thing. I like to think I'd be helping to feed someone.
Third choice would be to donate my body to science or medicine.
These choices are not in order of preference.
I don't want to be buried or cremated. Like a few others have said, I'd like to donate my body to science.
My personal view is that cemeteries take up valuable space that could be used for other purposes like growing food. But I'm sure the practice of burying our dead isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
I still want to be sent to the taxidermist and turned into a party machine to be sold at auction with the proceeds going to RRS.
Speakers in the belly with volume control knobs on my nipples...
and guess where the draft beer comes out...
Atheist Books, purchases on Amazon support the Rational Response Squad server, which houses Celebrity Atheists.
Brilliant.
www.RichWoodsBlog.com
Good answers people. I hope that it gets atleast one person to consider the waste of cemetarys. I love the party machine idea! I need to check into the cost of this! Also depends on how old you are that could get scary.
Throughout human history as our species has faced the frighten terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are and where we are going; it has been the authority (the political, the religious, and the educational authorities) who have attempted to comfort us. By giving us order, rules, and regulation. Informing or forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question these authorities. THINK FOR YOURSELF…
Just to throw another fun thing into this thread...
I wanted to show you how much I completely agree with you by dropping a link to what I thought about funerals.
http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/the_rational_response_squad_radio_show/hamurookis_irrational_precepts/11946
Atheist Books, purchases on Amazon support the Rational Response Squad server, which houses Celebrity Atheists.
Cemetery land can be use efficiently. Cemeteries can be moved to make room for new infrastructure. Also, they are nice to look at. I don't think they are a waste and I wouldn't mind being buried in one, but it doesn't really matter to me what happens after I'm dead.
There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine
H.P. Lovecraft
I've already opted for cremation; has for donating to science; I just can't bring myself to accepting med-students playing Dr.Kildare with my favorite body parts between lectures.
Moving old cemeteries is a good idea; did anyone here ever see the original "Poltergist"? So maybe it is not such a good idea. Cemeteries are a great source of local history, the older the better. I've seen small town cemeteries in Maine that date back to the 1690's, I would not want to see them disappear. There is a small cemetery in Etobicoke that is protected by the Ontario heritage foundation, no one can get access to it because of three highways that were buildt around it; the 427, 421 & Airport Hwy. Such is history vs. a modern city.
"Very funny Scotty; now beam down our clothes."
VEGETARIAN: Ancient Hindu word for "lousy hunter"
If man was formed from dirt, why is there still dirt?
What will you care? You're dead.
Yes, I saw the original. Silliest damn movie, not scary at all.
Here in Portland, OR there are a number of "pioneer" cemeteries. They are scattered around what is now town and in the farm areas. The town ones are closed except to direct older descendants - those who have close family already in the cemetery. They are surrounded by what is now city, so they can't expand.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
If the cemeteries weren't derelict they could stack up the bodies. Eventually graves can be reused because there's nothing down there anymore and there is probably no family to complain. They wouldn't necessarily have to be expanded.
I wouldn't get rid of Père-Lachaise or Arlington cemetery for those reasons. It's probably not good to put chemicals in the ground but in time even that will dissipate so I don't see any reason to really be against cemeteries.
There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine
H.P. Lovecraft
If the cemeteries weren't derelict they could stack up the bodies. Eventually graves can be reused because there's nothing down there anymore and there is probably no family to complain. They wouldn't necessarily have to be expanded.
I wouldn't get rid of Père-Lachaise or Arlington cemetery for those reasons. It's probably not good to put chemicals in the ground but in time even that will dissipate so I don't see any reason to really be against cemeteries.
Personally, I'm not against them. The old ones can be a rather pleasant afternoon stroll. I don't see why not to stack up the bodies as long as the original headstones are left alone. But people generally get the heebie geebies over that sort of idea.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.