It works for me!
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Faith in Jesus works for me - it's exciting. I love the Bible and believe all of it - though there is mystery. There is mystery everywhere though, right? I am a incredibly happy believer in Jesus. I'm not a theologian, I just believe in Jesus.
I understand you can't make anybody believe in Jesus and the Bible, and I don't personally try to do that. But I highly recommend it from my experience with it. I can't get enough of the Bible or Jesus. I can't imagine trying to navigate through life without it at this point in my life.
I don't think Jesus or God is a thing you can prove to somebody. I heard about it a large percentage of my life and it didn't mean anything to me until a certain point - then that all changed.
So do you guys think that I'm fooling myself, not really happy, you don't believe me, or do you really think I can't be as happy or enlightened as you - are you evangelistic in that sense or what? What is the purpose of this site? Do you have something better to offer? If so, what is your gospel?
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He asked you those questions, so what are you talking about ?
Where exactly does he claim that his perspective is "almighty" ?
So your answer to the question : Is it possible that your belief that Jesus exists is incorrect?, is "no". That's kinda different from the last time someone asked you if there was any doubt. I guess your own perspective, "almighty" or not, is kinda shaky too.
In what universe can his "attitude" be considered arrogant ? You ended your last conversation with him by calling him an annoying insect. He never held that against you, so how is he the one who's arrogant ? Really, explain.
I guess I could ask you what you think you're talking about here, but you wouldn't tell me anyway, so what's the point ?
This amazingly long thread about fonzie needing "purpose and meaning" is quite boring now. Atheism does not and will not ever grant his desire so what's the point. He deserves his fantasy. I'm not usually that mean but he really does deserve it and I'm glad that such deserving people fall for carp like this.
He answers everything in a wacky rhetorical manner with no evidence of anything (those few questions he does seem to answer in his abstract way) his way of coddling and defending his frail little self absorbed world.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Rob, he has a pretty serious mental disorder, and the way in which he chooses to take his meds can only be making it worse. So I wouldn't say he "deserves" his fantasy. To borrow his wacky rethorical style, it's the only port in a storm that he can find. And that's just fine with me and everyone else here.
What I'm having a problem with is how he treats most of the posters here. Being religious does not give someone the right to treat other people like dirt, to lie, insult and threaten them.
As long as he keeps doing that, I'll keep asking him why.
It may be best to speak no more and make him seek another outlet for his frustrations. Mental health issues or not he is obviously quite torn.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Deal !
(I suggested that twice already this week, but people keep dropping back in
)
Sooo...., all in favor for letting him talk to himself (which, let's face it, is all he wants to do anyway), stop falling for the bait and seek your entertainment elsewhere, k ?
You'd be doing him a kindness.
Okay, let's see what you wrote this time.
I have an answer to each of the questions I asked, reflecting my beliefs. I'm not sure what 'all of the answers' means. Does it mean that I know everything? Of course I don't know everything.
Evidence.
I have changed, apparently.
I certainly don't have an almighty perspective, and my knowledge of various topics can get shaky at times.
Thank you very much for answering the question. You are, by far, one of the most devoted servants of Jesus Christ I have ever communicated with. You may take that as a compliment if you like.
I will say one more thing, however, even though I know my attempt to reason with you will be fruitless. I observe that you've admitted numerous times that you are a very fallible human being, just like all of us. Yet, at the same time, you assert that Christ equals truth and that it is not possible that he does not exist. You feel that you can make these claims with absolute confidence because Jesus is perfect, and ergo, cannot ever be wrong. However, you are compartmentalizing the fact that, ultimately, you are the one making these claims, not Jesus. You simply cannot use Jesus' perfection to establish confidence in your assertions unless you first prove that Jesus exists, is perfect, and supports your assertions. Until then, you are merely question begging, and all of your assertions are only as reliable as you are.
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
Not much...
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
Butterbattle,
What I mean is you have questions and think you have all the possible answers; to wit, "Which do you value more; (a) your beliefs (b) truth. You think the only answer is either (a) or (b) and expect me to subscribe to your premise and give you one of the two possible (only = butterbattle) answers to butterbattle's and maybe butterbattle's caddy's question. That's arrogant and illogical on your part to think there is only one of your two choices that satisfactorily answer "Which I value more". It's like me asking you, "Which do you value more Butterbattle, (a) your heart, or (b) your blood. I can't separate my belief from the Truth, which is Christ.
You are right and it seems like boring with the obvious that we don't know everything but it's very easy to get to thinking we know more than we do and drive beyond our headlights. This becomes a tribute to humility, which is a real state (seeing things as they are, realizing we can't totally trust our own view of things) as opposed to pride (a frame of mind supported on fresh air). So I appreciate your statement, which I can certainly subscribe to myself.
I can't accept your praise and "air toss" - if I fall too far I will break, but nice try. I view myself as a "little man" - compared to the martyrs and men of great faith who have both gone before and are now in the "cloud of witnesses" watching. So I don't take the compliment well meant, but thanks.
Now, though, you come in off the water to reality and "know my attempt to reason with you will be fruitless" so that was "all full of sound and fury, signifying nothing", and you have this question of my full assurance - in other words; "how can a weak, imperfect man have full assurance that Jesus is LORD, alive, died for my sins, living in me, etc" (my paraphrase).
You have brought up another question that's not an (a) or (b) type. I didn't come to this state of full assurance at first. For a long time after I believed in Jesus Christ and came to life in Him through death - as taught by the ordinance of immersed baptism - I experienced cleansing from my sins yet wandered for a long time in the wilderness struggling with doubts, mostly about whether I was totally accepted by God as a full fledged son (this experience is not unique with me). I persevered and, following the directions of the Word and my trainer, the Holy Spirit, followed my Commander (spiritually speaking here), crossed over the Jordan into full assurance and started taking the promised land which is mine in Christ to take (in other words, running sin out of my life, conquering sin which seems overwhelming with iron chariots through faith in Christ my Commander).
With this process of "sanctification" - working at fighting sin and getting things out of the way that interfere with communion with God - I became closer to God and tasted the heavenly gifts of fellowship with Him. He has drawn me near. I work continually to maintain my spiritual house - spiritual things in other words - to keep this fellowship with Him clear. In the process of working on this, things get easier in some respects - for example; preventative maintenance is usually easier than breakdown maintenance. But basically with sin out of the way; that is, the "washing of regeneration" that happens in Christ, being "born anew" along with the maintenance of "washing one's feet" from the daily grind, God draws His own near to Him and we can live in full assurance of faith - though we can't let ourselves become off-guard nor forget to realize that we ourselves are imperfect and need to totally rely on Him.
So He gets all the glory, which He can handle and He deserves. Man has a secret desire to do something himself to trust in or slide into accepting Jesus as One Who can help one save oneself. Man wants some of the glory, but the truth is; Salvation is all from God.
Let me ask you a question: If you met the light like Paul did on the road to Damascus would you try to make a complete turn around like he did? (a) no (b) yes (c) your essay answer as given.
Still finding takers , huh ? Oh alright then...
See, this is what I don't get. Why jerk us around for all that time, call people silly names, if you had the answer all that time ? You could have given us this answer the first time the question was asked. I hope it was more fun for you to do it like this, cause it certainly wasn't very amusing for me.
If you subscribe to it yourself, then that means that you admit you could be wrong about christ being truth.
Thanks.
(If the need arises, I'll help you remember that)
And just to show you how easy it is to answer a simple question the first time it is asked, I'll take this one too.
Yes.
(Maybe one day you'll do me the same courtesy)
His statement about not being able to imagine "no god" makes it clear. If you could ever get him to just imagine it you could make progress, is this not how most of us became atheists? You have to really want to know the truth and be willing to accept it before you can find it or even really begin to look for it.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
robj101,
This is an interesting statement robj101! "You have to really want to know the truth and be willing to accept it before you can find it or even really begin to look for it".
You have to admit the "atheist house" is a train wreck when it comes to any cohesive theme - other than the great sport of trying to tear down faith and breaking God's chains.
When it comes to answering questions there has never been a clear atheist answer to my original post - what do you have?/ what's your plan?/ what is your hope? The Tower of Babel becomes a good analogy of your building plan and atmosphere.
Let me predict what will happen in answer to this post.
This will be derided and attacked again as pure nonsense - rather than answered with a cohesive atheist plan for building up rather than tearing down.
Probably the caddy will come on and say that's been done a hundred times (please copy and paste if so).
There will be ideas - all different - that are just "shots at a venture" at life.
Admit it - you atheists have nothing to offer except an impromptu jazz approach to life. You have to really want to know the truth and be willing to accept it before you can find it or even really begin to look for it.
Christ has it all - always has - always will
The problem here is that you need more than what is available. I have told you a few times what I do and hope for. I'll attempt to simplify it.
I hope the human race may progress. I hope if I have any children they will have the opportunity to live in a decent world and have a fair shake at happiness.
In the short term I hope people can realize what true happiness is, not using fiction as a crutch, reality is just as fun. I try to "tear down" your jesus because to me it is not reality, and if I can help you to see reason and gain understanding I feel good about having done..yea good.
There is no afterlife, this is what you are seeking and I could also delude myself and make up any kind of god I like and invent any afterlife I wished for but it would not make it true. I have read and reread the bible from cover to cover 3x, it is clearly written by men who wished for people to adhere to their beliefs, slavery, ill treatment of women etc. You among others continue to fall for this and I feel bad because most people did not even have a choice, for most they are raised with it and like yourself can't even imagine a world without this "jesus".
So with no afterlife and nothing to look forward too after death atheism is a fail for you, doesn't mean it's wrong however. Perhaps if you can continue to fool yourself you can die with a smile on your lips but you will still be dead and gone having wasted much of what you did have in a bad religion.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
I know you are unable to distinguish between your beliefs and truth. You are simply unable to even comprehend the concept of being wrong about your most fundamental assumptions. That is why I asked the question in the first place. I simply wanted you admit this. Thank you for admitting it.
I can definitely agree with that.
I do not understand how any of your vague metaphors justify your confidence, but thanks for the description anyways.
(b) yes. Of course. He received extremely strong personal and objective evidence. According to Acts, he actually talked to God, was struck blind, and then healed three days later.
Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare
But you know thats not real right, it's just a story written by men right?
Sound familiar
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
If that's true, then why did you lie ?
(If you're wondering which of your lies I'm referring to, it's the one where you claimed not have authored a thread where you repeat exactly the same personal information, down to the most minute details, so let's skip the "I'm not a liar, you are" bit, ok ? )
Why would someone who really believes need to lie, and even seem proud of it ? It makes no sense.
So whatever we answer, it will be "just ideas", "just shots at a venture at life".
See, what I'm once again wondering is this : If you've decided that in advance, then why ask the question ?
And if that's really, truly, honestly your opinion, then why don't you tell people that when they answer all your questions in full ?
Example from post #505, your reaction to NoDeity's long list of answers :
That to you means the same as "you have not given me a clear answer" ?
And you wonder why people call you dishonest...
robj101,
Thank you for sharing "what's happening now" with you in that answer. We took different roads and have ended up in different places. There is a great gulf between us now that could be described, discussed probably to no profit because we took different roads concerning Jesus and the correction isn't going to be made driving through the gulf.
As you know and view with pity I believe the Scriptures as God-breathed totally. They say if you were "in Christ" and turned back like a "dog to vomit" or a "pig to mud" your state now is worse than before (but I don't think you have ever really tasted the heavenly gift, I mean I hope you aren't set in concrete on this). I don't bring that up to try to personally hurt or attack you and I can't see why it would since you don't believe in Jesus or Scripture so it's no more than a nursery rhyme to you - no more, no less - but I bring it up because I do think with the Scripture viewpoint as much as I am capable and aware of and trying to learn more - you don't, but that is the perspective I will continue here to address your points.
You hope the human race will progress. We would mean different things across the gulf by "progress", but I would call what you "wish" for "reform". What I see happening with Jesus and the gospel is "renewal, new life, everything new". The Scriptures you don't accept would say we don't need a reformation, we need a transformation - which mankind can have in being "born anew" in Christ. I have experienced being spiritually dead, my affections dead to the Scriptures, spiritual things, and God (which I would say you are), and now I'm experiencing spiritual life in Christ and thus real progress has been made (which you also don't accept I know) and is being made with upward trend as a result of fellowship with God and the constant maintenance of all encompassing faith - heart, mind, soul maintained with the help of the trainer - the Holy Spirit.
You want your children to have success and happiness. From the Scriptures and also from my personal experience apart from God who can have enjoyment? (No one) Again you would define happiness different across the gulf than I would; to wit, "it is more blessed to give than to receive", "better is a dinner of herbs where love is than a fatted ox and hatred with it", "the end of a thing is better than the beginning", "better to be in the house of mourning than the house of feasting" - all things you have read 3x that I accept as aspects of happiness. These are a few examples how we would define that happiness differently.
You also dismiss the reality of the unseen eternal spiritual world at this point in your life. This eternal reality is seen not with physical eyes but the eye of faith. Jesus opened the physical eyes of a blind man and He also opened the spiritual eyes of this blind man. He could open yours some day - it has happened to many who didn't think it would.
The fact that the blessings of God are a fail for you doesn't mean they are not real either - the hope of a new heaven, new earth, new glorious body instead of the body of humiliation. And most of all, the fact of fellowship with God in Christ being a fail for you doesn't mean it's not true and that many aren't experiencing it. Eternal life and the first fruits of these things have already begun for me. But spiritual things are for the spiritual...... They're not to be tossed in the gulf. Maybe a bridge...
You need to acquire satellites and "recalculate".
eh, go back to sleep.
Well yes, he would define all those things differently
He'd define them honestly.
If Fonz is the most magnificent Poe in the history of this and perhaps every atheist website in the history of history.
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck
We are all capable of believing things which we know to be untrue, and then, when we are finally proved wrong, impudently twisting the facts so as to show that we were right. Intellectually, it is possible to carry on this process for an indefinite time: the only check on it is that sooner or later a false belief bumps up against solid reality, usually on a battlefield.- George Orwell
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
You must lead a dreary terrible life with this burden on your mind.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
robj101,
So what is your application of this?
What's his "application" of a George Orwell quote ? Describing you, I should think.
robj101,
If you subscribe to this quote you must include yourself in the "all" as possibly deluded and unequipped for this war we are in. I have told you with me "Christ is all" and anyone who is a Christian would agree with that statement. If you make this world your all, any other man your all, any group or creed your all - you will find after you die your "all" is missing.
Yes, "all", means "all".
And whatever you choose to make your all, there is simply no way of knowing if you'll encounter any of it after you die.
It's dishonest to claim otherwise.
Since I've made a double post, I might as well ask again : Why did you lie ?
This seems to be what faith is for you : lying to people, and when confronted with proof of your deceit that can simply be read from the screen in front of you, you just ignore it.
"Works for me" ? Yes, that works for pathological liars just as well.
We'll just get a different sort of "all", Fonzie.
Either all of non-existence or (the thought you dream of and wank to) all torture while you and God watch.
"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin
That it takes an infinite + infinite iterations of the same question to even acknowledge it as "good" is diagnostic of jesus-induced menstrual brain cramps. That you proceed not to answer it is diagnostic of extreme mental hemorrhage.
Your ruminant-based syntax is symptomatic of advanced stage ovine neurodegeneration.
Since jesus obviously does not exist, I would have to believe there was a more reasonable explanation. If I had been heavily medicated with lithium at the time, while coping with the frustration of non-union carpentry work, I would attribute it to chemical impairment of my reasoning faculties, coupled with ulcer-induced bolshevikitis. If I went on to have fantasies of naked bloody men hanging from planks of wood, I would immediately seek psychiatric assistance, as by all indications, my Damascus brain infarct was affecting my ability to focus at work, and I was likely becoming a threat to myself and my grandkids.
If I subsequently noticed that I was becoming chronically dishonest: by opening new online accounts after being banned and then denying that I had done so; by repeatedly dodging simple 'a' or 'b' questions; by refusing to provide any rational basis for my beliefs despite multiple requests over several years, I would conclude that even if jesus existed (which she doesn't), I would be obliged to reject christianity. Empirical evidence would indicate that it leads to pathological dishonesty. Prevarication and intellectual cowardice does not work for me.
There are no theists on operating tables.
JcGadfly,
Here is an example of you projecting what you do on me. You claim I don't read your posts but I have told you the fact that I want you to be saved and take no pleasure in anyone going to hell. How could I be like Christ in any respect and want what you describe? But I guess there is also the aspect of faith that carries over to me since I believe in Christ you toss that out?
You speak casually about this which plays into the demo-derby which is the "all" of this atheist forum - there is nothing more than a few quotes that might be regarded as clever to one who hasn't been out much, and there are some big words paraded to disguise lack of substance, but there is no cohesive plan here, no building program, just the joys of nihilism.
I would have you be saved and have Christ be your all. If you read this put a star in the margin. Or maybe have your caddy give you a mulligan.
You've been running from his questions for almost 3 years now, and he's answered every one of yours several times, so what exactly do you think you're talking about here ?
There's a fella in this thread who disagrees. Here's his opinion on the atheist part of the conversation :
This is what happens to dishonest people such as you. The more they talk, the less they can say without contradicting themselves.
I'd say you reached that point quite some time ago.
Again, this "fonzie" fellow sees things differently :
Let's see what today's "fonzie"'s opinion is :
No amount of stars or golfing terms can hide your lies, I'm afraid.
Which again raises the question : Why did you lie ?
Hold up Anony. I must have hit really close to home for him to respond directly.
First off Fonzie, * (you gave me no room in the margins)
As a semi-professional actor, I look at the rehearsal process (and indeed, life) as a voyage of discovery. Most of the time I make discoveries about myself but occasionally I make discoveries about others.
You have made one of the latter discoveries about me - congratulations.
You asked "How could I be like Christ in any respect and want what you describe?". That's precisely the point - I don't believe you are like Christ in any respect.
You've given me mountains of evidence to support my belief. You lie, you evade questions that scare you, you insult those who commit the capital crime of disagreeing with you. Hmmm. perhaps in some respects you are like Christ - just not any of the positive ones.
Actually, I like the golf analogy. You just have both of us wrong.
You seem to think that Satan is my caddy. Actually I carry my own bag and take responsibility for my actions.
You believe that you are caddying for God and have Satan driving the cart. The problem is you take all the shots. If the shot lands where you want it to, God took the shot. If it doesn't, Satan took it. You take the swings and have God or Satan sign the scorecard (depending on how you did).
And mulligans? Forgiveness as the Christians view it is the ultimate unlimited mulligan. You can commit as many sins as you wish and be as reprehensible to other people as you desire. Then all you have to do is pray to Jesus tell him you're really sorry about what you did and you promise to try really, really hard not to do it again (until the desire or the benefit returns). Once you convince yourself that Jesus heard you, you're off scot free. No obligation to apologize to those you hurt - no need for restitution. Jesus (in the form Paul invented) took care of the need for such things.
Honestly, there are two things keeping me from being a Christian. I don't want to reacquire the fear of death I had as a Christian and I don't want to take the risk that I might wind up anything like you.
"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin
I know but unlike his usual MO he decided he wanted to play with me directly.
JcGadfly,
Well, regardless of your opinion of me it's not true that I want anything bad happening to you now or whenever. I must say your opinion of Paul and Jesus puts me pretty far back in the bus - and probably out the door under the bus in your opinion. That's ok.
But one thing really puzzles me. How is it that you feared death when you were a Christian? It doesn't add up. He came to rescue all who all their lives were under bondage to the fear of death. And you look back on that as a time you were a Christian? Are you sure you weren't just "playing a part", just "saying your lines"?
As for your caddy I hadn't thought of Satan actually.
JcGadfly,
You know I don't think you are the one to give a discourse on forgiveness. I bet you never learned to forgive as Christ forgave you - you might be like the guy in the parable that the rich man forgave a great debt then went out and jailed a guy who owed him 20 bucks after which the Master locked up the scoundrel and restored the original debt. Since you never learned to forgive (which is evidenced in your continued thing against Christianity, Christ, Paul etc,) when it came around to you forgiving you yourself you were in the same fix, reaping what you had sown. Maybe you get some relief though from role-playing and escape your guilty state for a moment.
You take my mentioning the truth to you as insult and desire for your hurt - as seen through your colored glasses, distorted conscience lens and blame me for your state because I'm the last one to remind you of the fact of your being traitor to the cause of Christ. Yet faithful are the wounds of a friend. Profuse are the kisses of an enemy (i.e.; your caddy, soon to bring your baggage and give you a light for your fires of hell)
I've taken the liberty of combining your responses to me in one post.
I'm happy that you wish me no harm (though I wish you'd quit veiling your threats in Scripture - you come off like Jonah after he preached in Nineveh. He wanted to see fireworks and was genuinely disappointed when God didn't destroy the city.)
My opinion of Paul comes from reading the Bible and textual criticism (particularly Maccoby's "The Mythmaker"
. What Paul and the Gospel writers (likely Christian converts of Paul's or had Paul's epistles in front of them) turned Jesus into would have offended Jesus if he knew of it. It did offend the disciples of Jesus who walked with him - they started a Messianic movement that was anti-Rome, not a religion with a pagan-based, deified Jesus that desired its adherents to stay subservient to the Roman Empire. Then again, it was likely payback for Paul's purchased Roman citizenship.
My fear of death as a Christian came from watching devout Christians around me mired in worry and fear that they hadn't prayed enough, read their Bible enough, believed in God enough to get into heaven - I learned that behavior from seeing these "saints of God" doing it. Put that together with continual theme in the Bible of needing to have total faith (no doubts) in order to get to heaven. Eventually (after about two decades) I got tired of trying to do the impossible and fearing death and hell because I didn't and couldn't.
As for forgiveness - you speak as one who has never had to approach another human and ask for it - have you ever had to apologize to anyone? Granted, your religion doesn't obligate you do so. That's actually interesting:
Jesus said "Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift."
I John I: 9 states "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness."
If they are discussing the same Jesus, why eliminate the requirement of making it right with your brother? Perhaps because they abandoned Judaism in favor of Paul's mystery cult?
And please don't go into the martyrdom trip on me - the "You look with disfavor upon the differences between my behavior and the Bible because you hate Jesus!". I hold Gandhi's view, "
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." You not only don't see this as a problem - you insist that Christ did act as you do.
As for being a "traitor to Christ" who is more of a traitor - me for honestly leaving the religion or those who claim to be loyal followers while undermining the cause of Christ at every turn?
As for a friend's faithful wounds - friendship is based on trust. You've proved yourself a liar and unworthy of such trust.
"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin
JcGadfly,
Let's see the lie you're talking about. You and your caddy have been blowing about this for a long time. Put up or shut up. Paste the lie here. Let's see it.
You seem to have nothing else to say to the rest of his post. And yet you will probably repeat all the crazy accussations he just responded to, as if he never did.
That also isn't very honest, so let's hope you don't do it, eh ?
As for your lies, I'm not sure why you're asking JC and your golfing companion to post them, since I just did as recently as posts #1816 and 1817. (Oh, and we still have to deal with the mystery of "yes" not meaning "yes". We'll leave that for later, shall we ?)
Why do you ask for something I've been doing for almost a year, and you've been ignoring for just as long ? Why ask for something that only just happened and you only have to scroll up a few posts to read ? Just exactly how dishonest can you get ?
Finally tired of running, meph ?
Okay, then explain to us why you lied about your first thread when I asked you in post #437.
We'll deal with the other lies after that, and then you can reply to the part of JC's post you ignored (which is most of it), and then we can all go home.
Anonymous,
You are always talking about what you said when, and explained then, blah blah blah. Post the exact lie. Let's go ahead and deal with the lie that you're talking about. Paste the lying statement I have made here. Come out from behind your horse weed. And by the way, not dancing when you pipe doesn't fit the definition of a lie.
HERE IS THE LIE AS COPIED AND PASTED BY THE ESTEEMED ANONYMOUS: (followed by location where found)
I posted the location of some of your lies in the mail you just replied to, so what are you talking about ?
Sure, I'll do it again.
Here one of your lies :
And here's another :
Unless you're in the habit of referring to yourself in the third person, this is a lie.
More importantly, it's one you can't get out of. You can't deny the "WHAT FAITH YOU" thread is yours, because you provided the proof that it is.
Which makes every post of yours in this thread a lie, because you never told us you were the same guy, asking the same questions, pretending you never got any answers.
For myself, i can only point to general incidents - those that appear frequently.
You claim to love the Bible but you don't seem to know what any of it says. I know this because you never seem to discuss the Bible when someone cites it in opposition to your positions (as you've done here).
You claim to never insult people in your posts yet you do it continually (as you've done here when you claim I don't understand forgiveness - a lack of experience in it on your part, perhaps?).
I'll leave the rest to Anony but I suspect it has something to do with you disavowing a previously banned identity while relating his life story verbatim.
"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin
How many hours on here has fonzie spent prostelyzing and preaching to atheists.
Go back to "god" because here:
Funny how Gandalf is reminiscent of "god" imagery.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
Anonymous,
Fonzie is wondering if that's what Anonymous has been badgering about over and over - "why did you lie?", but, "why did you lie?", yet, "why did you lie?", still, "why did you lie?" Fonzie has read some of Mephibosheth's posts Anonymous, so there is no lie here.
Fonzie would like to ask Anonymous, "Anonymous, why did you breathe?" And Fonzie would venture at least one answer: Anonymous' mother didn't say, "Anonymous' mother is an atheist and doesn't want to mess with Anonymous right now but instead get on with life, so Anonymouse can breathe".
Fonzie wants to inform Anonymous that a good apology consists of at the minimum three parts which do not need to necessarily be separated from each other:
As far as what you regard as "personal attack" - Fonzie wants to mention that personal attack is in the eye of the beholder. Nikita Khrushchev said for instance of Americans: "You spit in their face and they call it dew". What Fonzie has done is essentially the opposite; Fonzie has brought dew and Anonymous has seen spit.
You denied it was you, as the quote proves, so you lied.
Simple as that.
(Even simpler, I could ask you right now if you're the guy who made the "WHAT FAITH YOU" thread, but you wouldn't answer me)
Just avoiding admitting the lie won't make it go away, so you can stop trying to do that.
I just wan't to know why you lied.
(and while you're at it, explain why you're suddenly referring to yourself in the third person )
Okay, I have absolutely no clue what you think you're talking about here, or why you feel the need to start talking to yourself about my mother and apologies.
Look, you asked me to post your lies. I did. Now you're just ignoring them again, so what was the point of asking in the first place ?
That first lie wasn't about a "personal attack". You're going to skip that one completely ,are you ? Then why did you ask for it ?
If you mean your habit to shout abuse and threats at people, I'm really not sure what's so "dewy" about telling people they're buzzards and insect, and they should die if they're not going to do what you want.
You might as well re-define lying as "talking".
Anyway, the proof of your lies has been provided. Again.
Stop dancing around it and tell me why you lied to us.
Anonymous,
You would do well to consider that you have nothing to take refuge in except your continued demolition (in your eyes) of the gospel and faith and those who stand fast IN THE LORD.
There is no lie - the thing you have a "baby blanket" fixation on. "Fonzie HAS read Mephosheth's posts".
You have continually resisted the invitation to lay out your plan for life, your direction for success, your reason for living. You are the dancer Anonymouse. This "fill in the blank" question will make you dance again.
Another thing. Just because you break my posts up and make a remark about each part doesn't mean you have answered anything. It's just your way of showing off what you can do with your limitless impudence.
As for "personal attacks" from me - is it a personal attack to warn a person to get out of a burning building? Your view proceeds from your unbelief - which you have a right to I know, but from the viewpoint of faith in Christ warning you is no attack.
Here are my questions to you which I have answered for myself: What is the meaning of life? What is the meaning of death? What is worth putting all your heart, soul, mind and strength into in life? (notice there is no "a" and "b", you aren't limited to my answers, the space is empty, ready to receive yours):::
I'm still not sure what you mean by demolition. You asked me to post your lies, and even though I've done that many times before (just be ignored), I did it again.
And it was ignored again.
Also again : If you stand fast in the lord, then why did you lie ?
I know he has. The lie here is that he pretended (as the quote proves) that those posts were not his. I'm not sure why you bother to deny such an obvious fact.
It's the casual dishonesty that bothers me, as well as the fact that all the questions you asked us there were simply rephrased in this thread. If our answers don't satisfy you, okay, but why then keep repeating the questions ?
And I'm still left wondering : Why did you lie ?
As I have already told you numerous times, I answered your question about "my product" (as you liked to put it that time) before I even registered here. I already gave you the post's number. I'll do it again : It's #819. I suppose it's the fact that this is a post from your first thread that makes it invisible to you.
But sure, I'll adapt my first answer to your new list of questions. I hope you'll answer my single question (honestly) in return.
The meaning of life is to live, why ask for more ? The meaning of death is to cease to exist. What is worth putting all your heart, soul, mind and strength into life ? Other people. They make it worthwhile.
Being able to use the quote function doesn't make a person impudent. If you think a solid block of text would be more readable, just say so. Personally, I think this makes my comments more clear, and apparently, less easy to ignore.
No, my view here proceeds from the simple fact that insulting a person isn't an argument in any discussion. So I will again ask you to stop doing that.
It will save us both a lot of time.
(btw, your analogy once again highlights the problem you're trying to ignore : How exactly does shouting abuse and threats help a person in a burning building ?)
I have already pointed out what happens when someone answers all your questions.
First you thank them.
And then, a few weeks and pages later, you proudly declare nobody ever gave you a clear answer to any of your questions.
So please explain, what exactly is my (or anyone else's) motivation here to answer all your questions yet again, when you've clearly demonstrated that you will happily ignore any answer we give ?
Seriously, what is the use of talking to you, if you won't listen to us ?
We know you've read Meph's posts - did you (as many suspect) write them? That is the question that seems to scare you.
Is it a personal attack to want a person to get out of a burning building? No. Would the building be burning if you or the one you serve hadn't started the fire? Probably not.
There have been cases of arsonists who became firefighters because they got a thrill from saving people from what they caused.
I will once again answer your questions as they are asked.
What is the meaning of life? The meaning of life is what you put into it.
What is the meaning of death? Death is the end of life. I bring no other meaning to it and so I have no fear of it.
What is worth putting all your heart, soul, mind and strength into in life? Helping other people, making sure that my friends and family have a better chance at improving themselves than I have had.
Ok, your turn.
You say that Christ is the meaning of your life. Is this decision to borrow a meaning rather than create your own based on comfort, fear or laziness?
You say that through Christ death is the passage to a glorious afterlife. I'm glad that brings you contentment. Does that contentment come from a lack of ability to find it in yourself or a lack of desire to do so?
You say that serving Christ is worth putting all your heart, soul, mind and strength into. Is that because of a love for him or because you want to rack up points to make sure you get to heaven? Could it even be that you want to pad your resume so that you can claim to be better than your fellow believers? What makes serving an all powerful being better than helping the people around you?
I won't waste time with the a/b question. You believe your belief is the truth - again, is that due to comfort, fear or laziness?
"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin
Without some divinely defined meaning, the only other meanings we could draw from life are those we assign to it ourselves... And isn't that a liberating thought? Meaning o' death is the ending of life. That one's easy. And whatever I decide I want to put all my heart, soul, mind and strength into is what is worth doing so for.
Give me some more, I'm game for this.
Bridge breeding proves evolution false.
Hey, hello. Welcome to the site.
Uhm, yeah...just to give you some idea about why this thread is as long as it is :
Here's an example of the best you can hope for, if you spend a few posts jumping through all his hoops :
And here's him, a few pages later, talking to the very same guy :
Now imagine over 1800 posts of this happening over and over and over again. No matter what you say, no matter how many times you answer his questions, he will eventually claim it never happened. (Yes, even if you quote the posts where it did)
I've warned people about this guy before. They usually give him the benefit of the doubt anyway.
Oh well, I tried..